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Author Topic: How do you guys manage your hydro costs?  (Read 1588 times)

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Offline Admiral T-Wayne

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How do you guys manage your hydro costs?
« on: September 03, 2015, 04:35:56 AM »
Hi, guys, I'm a large player over in Original, seeking advice with respect to how you folks manage to afford to keeping playing this game.  I understand that you have incredibly large fleets (I was going to say quintillions of ships, but I don't have a handle on your exact cap level).  So, I imagine you consume mind-boggling amounts of fuel, particularly to run the hydro-hog Dios on NPC scoop missions.  What levels of hydro storage units are common among the very top tier of Conquest players?  Besides merchanting in larger and larger units, are there other things you do to manage your hydro costs?

Offline commander abаб

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Re: How do you guys manage your hydro costs?
« Reply #1 on: September 03, 2015, 12:11:30 PM »
Hi, guys, I'm a large player over in Original, seeking advice with respect to how you folks manage to afford to keeping playing this game.  I understand that you have incredibly large fleets (I was going to say quintillions of ships, but I don't have a handle on your exact cap level).  So, I imagine you consume mind-boggling amounts of fuel, particularly to run the hydro-hog Dios on NPC scoop missions.  What levels of hydro storage units are common among the very top tier of Conquest players?  Besides merchanting in larger and larger units, are there other things you do to manage your hydro costs?

Upto ~2.2 quadrillion ships the max button works when sending ships, leaving one or two behind starting in the quadrillions. Above that, it is necessary to copy your ships available and paste it into the ships to send field as the max button overestimates.

The cap level on any one ship is:

Hephaestus Class Attack Platform Hephaestus ‎‎[] has:

RESOURCES:
* ore: 33,470,777,855,494,333,140,760
* crystal: 33,457,626,471,149,949,499,674
* hydrogen: 14,709,112,426,453,425,224,512

..'S SHIPS:
* Hermes Class Probe: 50,201,554,274,812,821
* Artemis Class Fighter: 9,200,000,000,000,000,662
* Atlas Class Cargo: 9,200,000,000,000,000,662
* Erebus Fighter: 2,765,665,746,158,336,512
* Zagreus Class Recycler: 499,982,754,505
* Dionysus Class Recycler: 301,215,457,151,857,893
* Curetes Class Cruiser: 2,500,000,000,000,004
* Poseidon Class Cruiser: 5,932,157,864,821,082,112
* Carmanor Class Cargo: 201,546,181,132,866,452
* Moros Battleship: 7,713,027,539,978,978
* Gaia Class Colony Ship: 308
* Athena Class Battleship: 9,223,372,036,854,775,807   <<--this number
* Hades Class Battleship: 2,686,923,365,847,973,376
* Prometheus Class Destroyer: 250,000,000,000,003
* Zeus Class: 50,000,000,001,004
* Hephaestus Class Attack Platform: 1

DEFENSES:


BUILDINGS:


MINES:


TECHS:
* Laser Tech: 14
* Armor Tech: 19
* Weapons Tech: 19
* Shield Tech: 19
* Particle Tech: 10
* Jet Drive: 20
* A.I. Tech: 20
* Energy Tech: 11
* Espionage Tech: 19
* Pulse Drive: 17
* Plasma Tech: 9
* FTL Tech: 9
* Expedition Tech: 8
* Warp Drive: 16
* Advanced Research Communication Network: 6



We have our own triton of sorts. It's name is Mathematical Imprecision:

Hey, I gained two zeus!!

To: Commander ABаб
Date: 2015-08-30 21:35:30 UTC
In the attack from name withheld ‎‎‎[x:y:z] on Military Territory ‎‎‎[x:y:z]:

You failed to take over the territory.


The attacking side acquired 0 resources.

Commander ABаб (ATTACKER) lost -20,000 RSP and gained 0 DSP. (less)
* Contributed 16,545,065,579,176,960,000 RSP to the battle.
* Lost -10,000,000 ore, -8,000,000 crystal, and -2,000,000 hydrogen in damages.
* Acquired 0 ore, 0 crystal, and 0 hydrogen in plunder.

* Lost -2 of 1654506557917696 Zeus Classes (1654506557917698 remain).


Territory (DEFENDER) lost 15,259,692,808,156,167,894 RSP and gained 0 DSP. (less)
* Contributed 76,908,444,297,528,452,622 RSP to the battle.
* Lost 11,003,449,158,646,610,049,000 ore, 4,169,122,137,467,971,578,250 crystal, and 94,367,772,109,532,012,000 hydrogen in damages.

* Lost 5623995887496112 of 28342257835730024 Atlas Class Cargos ( 22718261948233912 remain).
* Lost 295697283053922 of 1490173322543149 Artemis Class Fighters ( 1194476039489227 remain).
* Lost 4383329562533865 of 22089891089095911 Erebus Fighters ( 17706561526562046 remain).
* Lost 12489916119424 of 62943222236419 Zagreus Class Recyclers ( 50453306116995 remain).
* Lost 13694371253109802 of 69013101843971658 Hercules Class Cargos ( 55318730590861856 remain).
* Lost 1713719134899966 of 8636327364205004 Curetes Class Cruisers ( 6922608229305038 remain).
* Lost 18549278888744602 of 93479521580113706 Dionysus Class Recyclers ( 74930242691369104 remain).
* Lost 4544875077900443 of 22904003464054311 Poseidon Class Cruisers ( 18359128386153868 remain).
* Lost 26584470114842692 of 133973054300468948 Carmanor Class Cargos (107388584185626256 remain).
* Lost 7917525792090693 of 39900555034079837 Moros Battleships ( 31983029241989144 remain).
* Lost 220089061113589531 of 1109143932834962331 Athena Class Battleships (889054871721372800 remain).
* Lost 12229553823312 of 61631120400864 Hades Class Battleships ( 49401566577552 remain).
* Lost 17148920107591 of 86422380993254 Ares Class Bombers ( 69273460885663 remain).
* Lost 10959342860949 of 55229862768174 Prometheus Class Destroyers ( 44270519907225 remain).
* Lost 2419976304427 of 12195526765752 Thanatos Class Destroyers ( 9775550461325 remain).
* Lost 279712975218 of 2096433838532 Zeus Classes ( 1816720863314 remain).



66,370,871,604,702,552,784,896 ore and 2,084,561,068,733,981,786,112 crystal are now floating at this location.
There was a 0.0% chance that a moon would form from the debris.
However, no moon formed. (most of the ore was already there)



The max resources found on an npc:

RESOURCES:
* ore: 9,223,372,036,854,775,807
* crystal: 9,223,372,036,854,775,807
* hydrogen: 9,223,372,036,854,775,807


There seems to be no limit on the debris fields as I've seen ore amounts in the low septillions (2 followed by 8 commas).

This is my largest hydro storage with the logistics specialist:

Hydrogen Storage level 66
+2 Bonus to storage building levels
Hydrogen is a volatile resource, so a special Hydrogen Storage tank is required in order to keep larger quantities of it on hand.
Capacity:3,794,275,180,128,450,048 (enough to fleetsave in place, ss with)
upgrade to level 67
Time:13:51:06
Ore:147573952.59Q
Crystal:147573952.59Q
Hydrogen:0
Production
Capacity:+2,276,565,108,077,050,112


The larger players sell 1-2 sextillion hydro for 25000 credits, so theirs must be some number of levels higher.

To save hydro, players dump their ships on their hephs, use pmode,  propulsion mechanic, etc.
« Last Edit: September 03, 2015, 12:15:40 PM by Username 1 »

Offline Admiral T-Wayne

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Re: How do you guys manage your hydro costs?
« Reply #2 on: September 03, 2015, 10:07:46 PM »
Whew!  OK, I now know what to aspire to.  I should get there in about 3 years or so :-)

Offline Capt. Powerhouse

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Re: How do you guys manage your hydro costs?
« Reply #3 on: September 08, 2015, 08:35:11 PM »
Personally I buy from highlander. Have all ship on heph apart from few million Probes for probing others.
I don't farm terrys just hit others. Currently ranked #7 with 2,359,287,823,452,548,104,192 dsp only had account 3/4 months. Only had 32 quin dsp when I got the account.

Offline SithPurge

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Re: How do you guys manage your hydro costs?
« Reply #4 on: September 10, 2015, 07:43:17 AM »
besides having someone else merc for me, I do whatever I can to cut back on hydro output. for example I add 1 Thanatos to a Harvest. saves a % of the over-all and only adds 1 minute or so to travel time. I can't recall exactly what the % was but I think it was 5% or 10%. it does add up if you do as much collecting as I have been known to do.

if I'm putting a massive fleet on my Heph, I'll use p mode and slow the deployment using zeus, as much as possible... ANY thing to cut costs, pretty much.  lol
Everything I tell you is a lie... even that.   :P

Offline Admiral T-Wayne

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Re: How do you guys manage your hydro costs?
« Reply #5 on: February 21, 2016, 08:42:51 PM »
If you guys will bear with me, I'd like to resume this topic.

We are really starting to see the effects of divergence between the res needed to upgrade a hydro storage and the hydro created per invocation.  For example, if we examine the OC needed to create HS 58 -> 63, vs. the hydro per merchant, we see numbers such as these (in quadrillions):

O or C for HS 58 -> HS 63:  288, 576, 1152, 2304, 4608, 9216

Hydro per merch, HS 58 -> HS 63:  88, 141.3, 226.1, 361.7, 578.7, 926.

For HS 58, the hydro/res value is about 0.3, while for HS 63, the hydro/res value is about 0.1

So, if one attempts to maintain a constant-cost-of-play model, the time needed to build the HS 63 will be about 3x the time needed to build the HS 58.  If one attempts to maintain a constant-time-of-upgrade model, the hydro cost to build the HS 63 will be about 3x the cost of the HS 58.  And, these numbers continue to diverge as you continue to build larger and larger HS units.

If you follow the constant-cost-of-play model, you eventually get to the point where essentially all your time is spent building HS units, and where is the fun in that?

Do any of you guys, other than the guy (or guys) at the very top, still build your own HS units?  Or, is the default to simply buy hydro from the king of the hill?


Offline commander abаб

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Re: How do you guys manage your hydro costs?
« Reply #6 on: February 21, 2016, 10:31:34 PM »
Without Territory building bonuses or basic android workers, the time to go:

from 66 hydro storage to 67 is 13h 51m with foundry 55 Capitol 54. 
from 64 hydro storage to 65 is 27h 42m with foundry 52 Capitol 54. 

Conquest times. 

Three times longer if you are speaking of original. 

The Capitol 54 gets the foundry build time down to 2h 32m with 19 workers giving 38% faster build times.  Not much sense increasing the Capitol beyond 54, as you can get the max 75% faster build time by using Basic Android workers or defending territories.

The build time of the storages can be kept constant as long as the foundry is increased with each level.  The foundry build time is constant with each level, and can be decreased by increasing the Capitol.

The resources needed for each level of everything is always double the previous, but you are right - the benefit gained decreases.

Yes, I still build hydro storage units.  :)

Offline Admiral T-Wayne

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Re: How do you guys manage your hydro costs?
« Reply #7 on: February 23, 2016, 04:26:19 AM »
I for sure wasn't clear!  I'm not focusing on the time needed to actually ** build ** the sucker, I'm focusing on the time needed to collect the res to build the units (big difference, sorry!).

Do you see the res collection times for your upgrades expanding on you, or are you able to keep these time periods relatively constant, by more-or-less doubling your fleets between res collection periods?

And, finally, what types of ships do you most commonly use for NPC whacking?  In SFCO, I see 3 primary options:

Z-fleets.  Hydro to build them and to power the Dios
Heavy battleships.  Hydro to build them and to rebuild them, and to power the battleship and Dios fleets
Athenas.  Hydro to power the battleship and Dios fleets.

I'm a Z-fleeter, myself.  We don't have the Than, which I'm sure is another option for you guys.

Offline WGW

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Re: How do you guys manage your hydro costs?
« Reply #8 on: February 23, 2016, 12:49:19 PM »
A bit of trivia and possible help for the frog .......

9223372036854775807 is 2^63-1, which is the largest 64-bit integer. When you add 1 to it, strange things happen.

A possible solution to this problem is to use a BigDecimal instead of an integer in variables. I found an implementation of BigDecimal in ActionScript 3 here: https://github.com/maurice/BigDecimal.as

(cross posted from GitHub issue: https://github.com/LLK/scratch-flash/issues/633)

pasted from a developer site...

“And he who wields white, wild magic gold is a paradox. For he is everything and nothing. Hero and fool. Potent, helpless. And with one word of truth or treachery, He will save or damn the earth. Because he is mad and sane. Cold and passionate, Lost and found”

Offline The Real Highlander

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Re: How do you guys manage your hydro costs?
« Reply #9 on: February 23, 2016, 07:48:03 PM »
I quit playing Conquest for several reason but the main reason was because of the time it took me to collect 1 DF.  I had the max number of dinos on my Heph and depending on the size of the DF it was taking me anywhere from 25-40 trips to pickup 1 DF. At 2 mins per trip it was taking me 1-1.5 hours to collect 1 DF. This was just too long to spend collecting debris.

My other issue was that BFG changed the NPC and territories so that they would produce a lot less debris. I can only assume they did this to slow growth in the universe. I do not know if it is still like this.

Before BFG changed the NPC I figured it was going to take me 3-4 months to save the resources for my next level on my hydro storage level 78. After the changes I figured it would take me 6-7 months. If I had stayed around and did my next level on my hydro storage level 79 it would have taken me over 12 months to save for. After I realized this I decided it was time to quit Conquest and start over in another universe.

Below is the amount of Ore and crystal I would have needed to start my next level of hydro storage level 78.
     Ore - 302,231,454,903,657,293,676,544,000
Crystal - 302,231,454,903,657,293,676,544,000

Below is the capacity of my Hydro storage Level 77, This is without the logistic specialist.
 260,740,604,970,815,389,696

I hope this answered your question.
« Last Edit: February 23, 2016, 07:56:44 PM by The Real Highlander »

Offline Ali Baba

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Re: How do you guys manage your hydro costs?
« Reply #10 on: February 23, 2016, 09:48:32 PM »
Highlander want uni are you playing?

Always was a great player to be around.


And these numbers are insane. If I was BFG I would put a sell by date in this uni and close up shop before it implodes in on it self.

Offline The Real Highlander

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Re: How do you guys manage your hydro costs?
« Reply #11 on: February 23, 2016, 10:36:58 PM »
I am playing Eradeon 3. I picked it because I would be able to increase my ships capacity and speeds with Eradeon.

Offline Ali Baba

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Re: How do you guys manage your hydro costs?
« Reply #12 on: February 23, 2016, 10:48:20 PM »
Is it any good mate? I'll be looking for a new game to play soon because Conquest 2 is rapidly growing at a rate that isn't sustainable.

Offline The Real Highlander

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Re: How do you guys manage your hydro costs?
« Reply #13 on: February 24, 2016, 01:02:05 AM »
I would have to say it is dying. Less than 266 players. Of those less than 20 playing daily and of those less tan 5 playing seriously.

Offline DolphinDiver

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Re: How do you guys manage your hydro costs?
« Reply #14 on: February 24, 2016, 03:46:43 PM »
I would have to say it is dying.

Isn't that something you can say about each uni?

 

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