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Author Topic: Defense: A Strategical Discussion  (Read 10683 times)

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Offline azzaron

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Defense: A Strategical Discussion
« on: January 19, 2010, 05:41:12 AM »
There are 2 main things to discuss when it comes to defense:
1. How much defense to build.
2. What defense to build.

These two areas will be discussed below...


How much defense should I build?

Deciding how much defense to build is a delicate balance. Keep in mind that the goal of defense is to defend the resources you produce while fleet saving (or perhaps some you transport in, etc).

On the one hand, you don't want to go with no defense. If you don't have any defense, then any resources you produce while away from your computer (such as when you're sleeping) are wide open to anyone with some stray cargo ships. Yes, I'm assuming you're fleet saving here; if you're not, your fleet will not last long!  :?

On the other hand, you don't want to go with too much defense. Building too much defense will be an enormous drain on your resources causing you to fall behind in building/ship production and research. The biggest thing to realize is that NO amount of defense is completely impregnable to a determined attacker. Do not plan on using defense to avoid fleet saving.

Basically, you want to have enough defense to cause anyone to attack you to lose more resources in lost ships than they could possible gain... and not too much more.


What defense should I build?

First off, always build the decoy and the large decoy. They rock... not just because of their shields, but also because they stop rapid fire strings!

It is imperative that you include plasma cannons in your defense. If you don't include plasma cannons, then someone will be able to send in mass proms/hades/athenas/ares and take out your defenses with no losses. Plasma cannons are the only defense that ensures an attacker will incur losses by only sending battleships. Gauss cannons are great, but you need plasma cannons to really inspire fear. Using plasma/gauss will ensure they they have to send fodder with their attack.

That being said, your defense cannot only consist of plasma and gauss cannons. If you do that, then all of the battleships will hit your guns and take them out. Your big guns cost way too much to let this happen. As such, it is imperative that you create fodder defense for your gauss/plasma arsenal.

Your defensive fodder should be made up for 50% missile batteries and 50% laser cannons. The reason why you want an approximately even split between the two is to limit the rapid fire capabilities of poseidons and proms. If you only have missile batteries then poseidons will rip you to shreds. Similarly, if you only have laser cannons, then proms will rip you to shreds. Sure, ares can rapid fire against both, but there's not much you can do about that.

While pulse and particle cannons do serve a purpose, they should only be used in moderation. They cost too much to serve as fodder, and don't pack enough of a punch to threaten the battleships.

Finally, make sure that you have ABMs. If you don't have ABMs protecting your defense, someone near you can fire off a few ICBMs and decimate all your hard work; remember, there's no 70% regen rule for nukes! ICBMs take up twice the amount of space as ABMs and cost more... so they are a very effective deterrent.


Recommended Defense Strategy

Taking all of the above into consideration, I recommend the following ratio of defenses when your mines are around level 20/18/15:
1 Plasma
4 Gauss
5 Particle
5 Pulse
50 Laser
50 Missile
15 ABMs

As you increase your mine levels, continue to build more defense with the approximate ratios above. It should be noted that the cost of 1 Plasma is approximately equal to the cost of 4 Gauss, which is approximately equal to the cost of both the 50 Lasers and the 50 Missiles.

Credits: Thank you to Nero and Laggynate for your input!
« Last Edit: January 19, 2010, 03:41:58 PM by azzaron »

Offline bryn987

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Re: Defense: A Strategical Discussion
« Reply #1 on: January 19, 2010, 05:42:24 AM »
or you could build 0 defenses and save a ton of loot that you could then spend on ships
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Offline azzaron

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Re: Defense: A Strategical Discussion
« Reply #2 on: January 19, 2010, 05:44:34 AM »
Quote from: "bryn987"
or you could build 0 defenses and save a ton of loot that you could then spend on ships
Quote from: "azzaron"
On the one hand, you don't want to go with no defense. If you don't have any defense, then any resources you produce while away from your computer (such as when you're sleeping) are wide open to anyone with some stray cargo ships.
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Offline Nero

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Re: Defense: A Strategical Discussion
« Reply #3 on: January 19, 2010, 05:45:41 AM »
Quote from: "azzaron"

Taking all of the above into consideration, I recommend the following ratio of defenses when your mines are around level 15:
1 Plasma
3 Gauss
50 Laser
50 Missile
3 ABMs

As you increase your mine levels, continue to build more defense with the approximate ratios above. It should be noted that the cost of 1 Plasma is approximately equal to the cost of 3 Guass, which is approximately equal to the cost of both the 50 Lasers and the 50 Missiles.


Hmmm.... I would think that in order to have a plasma cannon your mines would have to be past lvl 15. Maybe somewheres around lvl 20 ore lvl 18 or 19 crystal and lvl 15 or 16 hydro. If your not pumping out res to the max it will break you in order to upgrade to get the gauss and plasma canons.
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Offline Laggynate

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Re: Defense: A Strategical Discussion
« Reply #4 on: January 19, 2010, 05:48:15 AM »
I'll read it again in greater detail tomorrow, but one thing I disagree with is your ratio.

Through a significant amount of trial and error with our combat sim, It can be seen that pulse and particle cannons do serve a purpose.
The most bang for your buck in terms of preventing profitable attacks is:

50 Missile
50 Laser
5 Pulse
5 Particle
4 Gauss
1 Plasma

The only weakness to this ratio is it's susceptibility to extremely Ares heavy fleets. However, the fuel costs will often deter players at that point.

This is a less cost effective ratio but it will deter people bashing your planet just to wear down your defenses.

50 Missile
50 Laser
10 Pulse
10 Particle
5-7 Gauss
1 Plasma
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Offline azzaron

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Re: Defense: A Strategical Discussion
« Reply #5 on: January 19, 2010, 06:04:19 AM »
Nero: I had that (minus the plasma) when my mines were level 15 without too many problems... but I guess I was getting lots of outside dough from raiding. I'm more just trying to outline a long-term ratio and give people a goal of when to get "level 1" of that ratio... but perhaps your mine levels are a better goal for when to achieve that...

Laggynate: Thank you very much for the scientific input! I will update my original post (with credit where due of course). Oh, and Ares ruin any defense... not much you can do about that   :(
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Offline Laggynate

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Re: Defense: A Strategical Discussion
« Reply #6 on: January 19, 2010, 06:12:03 AM »
Well there is, but it then you are vulnerable to other, more common, fleet compositions :P
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Offline bryn987

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Re: Defense: A Strategical Discussion
« Reply #7 on: January 19, 2010, 06:19:21 AM »
Quote from: "azzaron"
Quote from: "bryn987"
or you could build 0 defenses and save a ton of loot that you could then spend on ships
Quote from: "azzaron"
On the one hand, you don't want to go with no defense. If you don't have any defense, then any resources you produce while away from your computer (such as when you're sleeping) are wide open to anyone with some stray cargo ships.

My mines don't produce enough overnight loot to tempt anyone
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Offline sfman

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Re: Defense: A Strategical Discussion
« Reply #8 on: January 19, 2010, 07:11:49 AM »
Hmmm.. why just 3 ABMs?
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Offline Vienneau

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Re: Defense: A Strategical Discussion
« Reply #9 on: January 19, 2010, 02:23:01 PM »
I would think you want at least 6 ABMs for any significant defence because a common strategy is to get level 4 Missile Silo and build 30 ABMs and 5 IPMs and 6 ABMs forces the attacker to work at it a bit.  

20+ ABMs forces a group attack and 500,000 in missile resources, so it's almost never worth it unless you have some really massive mines.
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Offline azzaron

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Re: Defense: A Strategical Discussion
« Reply #10 on: January 19, 2010, 03:16:38 PM »
The 3 ABMs are a ratio - you will only ever actually have 3 when you are on "level one" of that ratio. Once you start on your 2nd plasma, or your 5th gauss, etc... you should start working up to 6 ABMs. In fact, the thing you stated about a lot of people carrying 30 ABMs and 5 IBMs is exactly why I get you up to 6 ABMs at "level two" of that ratio.

When you only have "level one" of that ratio, it's unlikely someone near you already has a full level 4 missile silo.
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Offline Laggynate

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Re: Defense: A Strategical Discussion
« Reply #11 on: January 19, 2010, 03:28:07 PM »
I missed the ABMS part. I personally go with 15 ABMs in my ratio.
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Offline azzaron

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Re: Defense: A Strategical Discussion
« Reply #12 on: January 19, 2010, 03:41:39 PM »
Quote from: "Laggynate"
I missed the ABMS part. I personally go with 15 ABMs in my ratio.
Seriously? Wow   :shock:

Alright, well I bow to the wisdom of those far more experienced than I...
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Offline Laggynate

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Re: Defense: A Strategical Discussion
« Reply #13 on: January 19, 2010, 04:33:10 PM »
Yea, 6 ABMs won't stop people from nuking your defenses. 30 Is a pretty good deterrent though ;)
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Offline Rob

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Re: Defense: A Strategical Discussion
« Reply #14 on: January 19, 2010, 04:39:17 PM »
You need enough ABMs to make sure that the cost of the IBMs needed to knock them down is higher than the potential profit. i.e. if you have 500k of resources for the attacker to plunder, then that's 20 IBMs worth of resources. If you only have 15 ABMs, that's a 125k profit from the attack.

Also, don't forget that the attacker will most likely send multiple fleets to make sure they get everything. 4 fleets gets him ~94% of what's on your planet.

And don't forget to make sure that the regular defenses are up to the task, too. 40 ABMs won't do you any good you only have 1 plasma, 5 Gauss, and 50 MBs defending your 500k stash.
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