Starfleet Commander Forum

Starfleet Commander => Universe 2 => Topic started by: Bah on March 02, 2014, 08:15:24 AM

Title: NPCs largely unhittable except for top players' private zero techs
Post by: Bah on March 02, 2014, 08:15:24 AM
This happened a couple of weeks ago in uni 2, and I wonder if it has happened in other universes. The top player has more points than all the rest of the players combined.

I bring this up at this point because NPCs are currently unhittable except for the large zero techs that only the top 2 or 3 players can hit. I really can't fathom why there would be any time when defenses would cause players to stop playing. And as I've stated many times, I can't comprehend why only top players get zero tech npcs to hit.

On the original universe message board, Matt has stated that NPCs now are using 60% RSP for ships. I think this new formula has actually screwed up NPCs in this universe as previous to his statement defenses were far lower, and certainly below 40% if I understand his statement. Prior to this change NPCs were quite profitable and it was enjoyable to play. Any chance we can discard the new "fix"?
Title: Re: NPCs largely unhittable except for top players' private zero techs
Post by: Bah on March 02, 2014, 10:11:31 AM
Also, BFG should increase the spawning rate. Just now, as happens many times each day, I have looked thru several hundred systems without any new spawns in my range.
Title: Re: NPCs largely unhittable except for top players' private zero techs
Post by: Matt H on March 02, 2014, 03:47:42 PM
Any chance we can discard the new "fix"?

No. New NPCs spawning, in general, are far more balanced at all levels than they were before the change. Further reducing defenses from am average of 60% of the RSP to 40% means that NPCs are more profitable, not less.

 I'm sorry we can't make everyone happy.
Title: Re: NPCs largely unhittable except for top players' private zero techs
Post by: kru on March 02, 2014, 03:56:59 PM

 I'm sorry we can't make everyone happy.

and here's me thinking you'd be willing to just hand deliver rescources to all our planets
Title: Re: NPCs largely unhittable except for top players' private zero techs
Post by: napl on March 02, 2014, 07:54:56 PM
Matt - have you actually looked at what is spawning??
Title: Re: NPCs largely unhittable except for top players' private zero techs
Post by: Bah on March 02, 2014, 10:52:52 PM
No. New NPCs spawning, in general, are far more balanced at all levels than they were before the change. Further reducing defenses from am average of 60% of the RSP to 40% means that NPCs are more profitable, not less.


In this universe defenses are 500% to 1000% higher than before the fix on every NPC. Very frustrating and obviously substantially less profitable.
Title: Re: NPCs largely unhittable except for top players' private zero techs
Post by: CreoleLakerFan on March 03, 2014, 04:18:06 PM
Matt - have you actually looked at what is spawning??

I don't think it's the ratio of RSP to DSP that is the problem.  It's the ratio of NPC Fodder to Capitol ships that is hurting.  I cannot make a reasonable profit on the NPCs that have been spawning since 2/28 without launching anything less than 10-12 Million Proms, with 4-5 Million Ares accompanying them.  That severely limits how many fleets I can have active, makes launches expensive, and since the NPC fleet ratios shrug off fodder, I am taking major hydrogen losses in DSP.

I thought the point of the changes was to address hydrogen usage.  Perhaps this has been the effect in other universes, but the changes have made this worse than before in UNI2.
Title: Re: NPCs largely unhittable except for top players' private zero techs
Post by: CreoleLakerFan on March 03, 2014, 05:24:51 PM
Encounter Large Floating Colony ‎has:

RESOURCES:
* ore: 47,995,006
* crystal: 66,905,389
* hydrogen: 50,974,916

KRUG'S SHIPS:
* Artemis Class Fighter: 922,412
* Atlas Class Cargo: 92,794
* Apollo Class Fighter: 1,150,673
* Zagreus Class Recycler: 643,510
* Dionysus Class Recycler: 418
* Poseidon Class Cruiser: 5
* Carmanor Class Cargo: 473,860
* Athena Class Battleship: 269

DEFENSES:
* Missile Battery: 7,176,347
* Laser Cannon: 1,037,275
* Pulse Cannon: 213,610
* Particle Cannon: 229,091
* Decoy: 1
* Gauss Cannon: 43,767
* Large Decoy: 1
* Plasma Cannon: 41,683

Encounter Large Floating Colony ‎has:

RESOURCES:
* ore: 339,205,053
* crystal: 547,644,406
* hydrogen: 462,869,487

URCATH'S SHIPS:
* Artemis Class Fighter: 183,532
* Atlas Class Cargo: 29,145,050
* Apollo Class Fighter: 78,014
* Zagreus Class Recycler: 2
* Hercules Class Cargo: 4,164,483
* Poseidon Class Cruiser: 6,507,750

DEFENSES:
* Missile Battery: 68,911,315
* Laser Cannon: 12,050,258
* Pulse Cannon: 1,171,095
* Particle Cannon: 1,973,751
* Decoy: 1
* Gauss Cannon: 427,802
* Large Decoy: 1
* Plasma Cannon: 453,607


Encounter Large Floating Colony has:

RESOURCES:
* ore: 545,041,885
* crystal: 580,565,489
* hydrogen: 452,975,056

URCATH'S SHIPS:
* Artemis Class Fighter: 36,311,310
* Atlas Class Cargo: 341
* Apollo Class Fighter: 2,015,692
* Zagreus Class Recycler: 27,634,781
* Hercules Class Cargo: 175,588
* Dionysus Class Recycler: 4,783

DEFENSES:
* Missile Battery: 79,511,066
* Laser Cannon: 13,345,810
* Pulse Cannon: 1,364,033
* Particle Cannon: 2,453,640
* Decoy: 1
* Gauss Cannon: 507,546
* Large Decoy: 1
* Plasma Cannon: 532,259

Encounter Large Floating Colony has:

RESOURCES:
* ore: 43,446,949
* crystal: 147,223,241
* hydrogen: 93,716,220

URCATH'S SHIPS:
* Artemis Class Fighter: 4,929,794
* Atlas Class Cargo: 11,101
* Apollo Class Fighter: 63,330
* Carmanor Class Cargo: 101
* Athena Class Battleship: 2,098
* Ares Class Bomber: 10,447

DEFENSES:
* Missile Battery: 3,156,204
* Laser Cannon: 1,871,267
* Pulse Cannon: 85,957
* Particle Cannon: 86,368
* Decoy: 1
* Gauss Cannon: 19,906
* Large Decoy: 1
* Plasma Cannon: 18,073


Encounter Large Floating Colony ‎has:

RESOURCES:
* ore: 13,063,257
* crystal: 54,532,552
* hydrogen: 41,184,619

URCATH'S SHIPS:
* Artemis Class Fighter: 4,708,467
* Atlas Class Cargo: 226,369
* Apollo Class Fighter: 58,120
* Zagreus Class Recycler: 8
* Hercules Class Cargo: 23,746
* Prometheus Class Destroyer: 220

DEFENSES:
* Missile Battery: 4,163,967
* Laser Cannon: 793,650
* Pulse Cannon: 51,051
* Particle Cannon: 78,248
* Decoy: 1
* Gauss Cannon: 20,530
* Large Decoy: 1
* Plasma Cannon: 18,591

Encounter Large Floating Colony ‎has:

RESOURCES:
* ore: 545,041,885
* crystal: 580,565,489
* hydrogen: 452,975,056

URCATH'S SHIPS:
* Artemis Class Fighter: 36,311,310
* Atlas Class Cargo: 341
* Apollo Class Fighter: 2,015,692
* Zagreus Class Recycler: 27,634,781
* Hercules Class Cargo: 175,588
* Dionysus Class Recycler: 4,783

DEFENSES:
* Missile Battery: 79,511,066
* Laser Cannon: 13,345,810
* Pulse Cannon: 1,364,033
* Particle Cannon: 2,453,640
* Decoy: 1
* Gauss Cannon: 507,546
* Large Decoy: 1
* Plasma Cannon: 532,259

Encounter Large Floating Colony ‎has:

RESOURCES:
* ore: 51,785,287
* crystal: 59,321,726
* hydrogen: 48,288,666

URCATH'S SHIPS:
* Artemis Class Fighter: 71,510
* Atlas Class Cargo: 2,204,527
* Apollo Class Fighter: 1
* Zagreus Class Recycler: 207,790
* Hercules Class Cargo: 540,957
* Dionysus Class Recycler: 318
* Ares Class Bomber: 156,215

DEFENSES:
* Missile Battery: 5,512,184
* Laser Cannon: 2,976,817
* Pulse Cannon: 89,845
* Particle Cannon: 178,602
* Decoy: 1
* Gauss Cannon: 33,129
* Large Decoy: 1
* Plasma Cannon: 34,754

Encounter Large Floating Colony ‎has:

RESOURCES:
* ore: 27,198,746
* crystal: 65,864,020
* hydrogen: 51,734,882

URCATH'S SHIPS:
* Artemis Class Fighter: 9,717,205
* Atlas Class Cargo: 12
* Apollo Class Fighter: 4,124
* Zagreus Class Recycler: 7
* Hercules Class Cargo: 302,007
* Poseidon Class Cruiser: 39
* Carmanor Class Cargo: 1

DEFENSES:
* Missile Battery: 8,531,783
* Laser Cannon: 1,162,882
* Pulse Cannon: 126,263
* Particle Cannon: 195,278
* Decoy: 1
* Gauss Cannon: 42,968
* Large Decoy: 1
* Plasma Cannon: 42,382
Title: Re: NPCs largely unhittable except for top players' private zero techs
Post by: CreoleLakerFan on March 03, 2014, 06:02:21 PM
Here's the Espionage Report for my last hit.

Encounter Large Floating Colony ‎has:

RESOURCES:
* ore: 339,205,053
* crystal: 547,644,406
* hydrogen: 462,869,487

URCATH'S SHIPS:
* Artemis Class Fighter: 183,532
* Atlas Class Cargo: 29,145,050
* Apollo Class Fighter: 78,014
* Zagreus Class Recycler: 2
* Hercules Class Cargo: 4,164,483
* Poseidon Class Cruiser: 6,507,750

DEFENSES:
* Missile Battery: 68,911,315
* Laser Cannon: 12,050,258
* Pulse Cannon: 1,171,095
* Particle Cannon: 1,973,751
* Decoy: 1
* Gauss Cannon: 427,802
* Large Decoy: 1
* Plasma Cannon: 453,607

TECHS:
* Armor Tech: 19
* Shield Tech: 19
* Weapons Tech: 19

This was an in-system, so launch costs were much smaller than usual.  A total of 2.8 Billion Hydrogen to launch, using the Propulsion Mech for a savings of 10%.

Here is the truncated battle report:

CreoleLakerFan (ATTACKER) lost 35,246,535 RSP and gained 178,318,502 DSP. (less)

  * Contributed 3,130,494,815 RSP to the battle.

  * Lost 20,489,335,000 ore, 11,112,455,000 crystal, and 3,644,745,000 hydrogen in damages.


In summary, 6.3B Hydrogen losses to generate 50B Ore and 31B Crystal.  It took all of my Caps, so I can only launch one at a time.  My fodder is sidelined as these NPCs just laugh at them.  At this rate, I am going to run out of both fuel and resources (crystal) to convert to fuel. 

Since the inception of the game I have been very supportive of BFG with my wallet and ad-click/sponsored purchase.  I enjoy the game, and other subscription based games get pricey, so I have had no problem regularly purchasing credits.  If there are no significant changes with the UNI2 NPCs, I will burn through my credits more quickly than is worth to refill them.  I hope BFG addresses this, because I would hate to have to severely restrict my participation in UNI2 on account of hydrogen costs.
I
Title: Re: NPCs largely unhittable except for top players' private zero techs
Post by: Bah on March 03, 2014, 11:31:44 PM
Another cycle has come and gone and the 40% rsp formula "fix" remains. I might feel it weren't a grind if before it was 60% defense instead of the roughly 10% that it was. As it is, I shan't grind much longer.

Expectations might be the devil, but I expect if somebody applies a fix to something that isn't broken, they are obligated to undo the damage.
Title: Re: NPCs largely unhittable except for top players' private zero techs
Post by: Bah on March 03, 2014, 11:44:59 PM
I forgot to mention, as apparently Matt has forgotten to address, zero techs continue to be available to the top players only. This is now a serious disparity with the rise in defense.
Title: Re: NPCs largely unhittable except for top players' private zero techs
Post by: Matt H on March 04, 2014, 03:22:12 PM
I forgot to mention, as apparently Matt has forgotten to address, zero techs continue to be available to the top players only. This is now a serious disparity with the rise in defense.

We'll be deploying a fix this afternoon which should eliminate instances of zero tech NPCsappearing except at the lowest level of NPCs.
Title: Re: NPCs largely unhittable except for top players' private zero techs
Post by: kru on March 04, 2014, 04:00:52 PM
I forgot to mention, as apparently Matt has forgotten to address, zero techs continue to be available to the top players only. This is now a serious disparity with the rise in defense.

ye, way to go.......make the top players have to spend more vs loss....

ALL 0 tech npcs are available to everyone as there is no protection on npcs.....

Sometimes, moaning and bitching gets a serious role reversal.....now you will NEVER find a 0 tech except at the very lowest level....

Sometimes people like you piss me off......instead of re-designing your fleet outlay and hitting the 0 techs for 0 loss you just complain
Title: Re: NPCs largely unhittable except for top players' private zero techs
Post by: Bah on March 05, 2014, 06:04:27 AM
LOL I want zero techs for everybody. Troll, there is no way I could have redesigned my fleet to hit most large zero techs.

Anyway, now that we've gotten rid of that unfair advantage months after I first pointed it out (and was told by Matt I was incorrect about the distribution), let's get some more profit into the NPCs. Please either revert the formula to what it was in this universe or make a new one.

Also this may be coincidence but I have twice searched the 30 systems on either side of my planets in the past few hours and not found a single new spawn above 100M dsp (a level whose color would be mostly green to me). Unless there is something wrong with the spawning, I don't think I should be able to search 549 systems without finding an NPC. I suggest the spawning frequency be increased.

Title: Re: NPCs largely unhittable except for top players' private zero techs
Post by: commander abаб on March 05, 2014, 07:16:14 AM
Maybe move to a more inhabited galaxy?
Title: Re: NPCs largely unhittable except for top players' private zero techs
Post by: Bah on March 05, 2014, 08:00:23 AM
Maybe move to a more inhabited galaxy?
I'm in galaxy 1 twice and 3-9. Every location has at least 3 top ten players in the area (including myself) and G1s and G5 have many more.

Every one of the players I've talked to agrees we need more profit since the fix. If everyone agrees and it benefits BFG I don't understand why it isn't happening.
Title: Re: NPCs largely unhittable except for top players' private zero techs
Post by: commander abаб on March 05, 2014, 08:37:04 AM
I don't play universe2, so I really don't know about yours.  In SDE, I noticed that a lot of the extra ship RSP was in the form of more Zeus.  They really are more profiable here.
Title: Re: NPCs largely unhittable except for top players' private zero techs
Post by: Bah on March 05, 2014, 09:23:03 AM
As previously posted, since the fix we are getting very uneven distributions. I'm not sure if this is intentional but they have reduced profit tremendously and absolutely did not occur previously.
Title: Re: NPCs largely unhittable except for top players' private zero techs
Post by: kru on March 05, 2014, 11:41:45 AM
lol see, your trolled for a fix and you got it....now you are complaining because this is fixed there is now a reduced profit....

and you now realise why players like you piss me off?  you don't see the BIGGER picture.

Sounds to me this is what you were really asking for:

'Matt, i am sick and tired of of only finding most 0 tech npcs showing as pink or red to me, even though i can attack them as with anyone else these MUST be private npcs for the large players......meanwhile my npcs are spawning with techs wich reduce my profit.....can we not have so npcs i can hit are so much easier so i can make a bigger profit'

And now of course your saying:

'dam, i bitched about the npc techs and bfg fixed it, but since they fixed it my profit on npcs has dropped, so can we get a fix on the fix so it is easier for me'
Title: Re: NPCs largely unhittable except for top players' private zero techs
Post by: kru on March 05, 2014, 11:46:09 AM


Anyway, now that we've gotten rid of that unfair advantage months after I first pointed it out (and was told by Matt I was incorrect about the distribution), let's get some more profit into the NPCs. Please either revert the formula to what it was in this universe or make a new one.


as explained, but i will dumb it down (just for you)

The spawn ratio and ship - defence ratios are the same as before the tech fix.  The rescource ratio is also the same.  HOWEVER because YOU complained for a tech fix, it was fixed from the lowest spawned npc to the highest.

By altering this at its code you WILL see a reduction in profits as you are now facing off against more npcs with similar techs to yours or GREATER.

So, sure call me a troll, but as i stated in the above post, sometimes when you complain about one thing and demand a fix you fail to understand how it will affect everyone......

Your moaning now about profit, so it has obviously affected you........Best redesign your fleet, research higher AWS or just  get on with your reduced profit
Title: Re: NPCs largely unhittable except for top players' private zero techs
Post by: CAPTAIN SKEENAN on March 05, 2014, 01:13:42 PM
As previously posted, since the fix we are getting very uneven distributions. I'm not sure if this is intentional but they have reduced profit tremendously and absolutely did not occur previously.
Well I've always felt they were uneven top two guys got the most profitable npc and yea zero techs
Title: Re: NPCs largely unhittable except for top players' private zero techs
Post by: CAPTAIN SKEENAN on March 05, 2014, 01:14:58 PM
At the moment nothing worth attacking it's like they shut off anything over 3 mil dsp
Title: Re: NPCs largely unhittable except for top players' private zero techs
Post by: Monkey D. Luffy on March 05, 2014, 03:16:08 PM
lol see, your trolled for a fix and you got it....now you are complaining because this is fixed there is now a reduced profit....

and you now realise why players like you piss me off?  you don't see the BIGGER picture.

Sounds to me this is what you were really asking for:

'Matt, i am sick and tired of of only finding most 0 tech npcs showing as pink or red to me, even though i can attack them as with anyone else these MUST be private npcs for the large players......meanwhile my npcs are spawning with techs wich reduce my profit.....can we not have so npcs i can hit are so much easier so i can make a bigger profit'

And now of course your saying:

'dam, i bitched about the npc techs and bfg fixed it, but since they fixed it my profit on npcs has dropped, so can we get a fix on the fix so it is easier for me'

+1.

Title: Re: NPCs largely unhittable except for top players' private zero techs
Post by: Bah on March 05, 2014, 03:37:35 PM
Here's the change in profit. Prior to the fix I was making 300 to 400 billion converted rez per round of attacks. After the fix with 50% more ships, I was making 75B per round. Yesterday that dropped to 25B when I was able to find any. (Actually that's 25B when I could find a 16 tech. I found 2 16 techs and 3 21 techs. I took a loss on the 21 techs.)
I'm not going to spend hours looking for a couple targets that cost me 20B in fuel to make 25B profit.
Title: Re: NPCs largely unhittable except for top players' private zero techs
Post by: napl on March 05, 2014, 03:54:34 PM
Its obvious kru is confused with the point of this whole post.  Its not about the 0 techs that kru is disappointed to lose.  It was about the defense RSP fix that wasn't necessary in uni2.  Does kru play uni2?  Does he understand the issue?  Doubtful.  There was a significant decrease in profit from the defense RSP fix. That is the point of the post.  The 0 tech was a side issue that no one expected BFG to do one damn thing about since we've been asking them to fix it for over a year and the canned response was "they appear at all levels" which was utter BS.

The 0 tech RSP fix only effects the top 3 players in uni2 (sometimes some others benefited in insignificant ways from the 0 tech).

Title: Re: NPCs largely unhittable except for top players' private zero techs
Post by: kru on March 05, 2014, 04:15:02 PM
Its obvious kru is confused with the point of this whole post.  Its not about the 0 techs that kru is disappointed to lose.  It was about the defense RSP fix that wasn't necessary in uni2.  Does kru play uni2?  Does he understand the issue?  Doubtful.  There was a significant decrease in profit from the defense RSP fix. That is the point of the post.  The 0 tech was a side issue that no one expected BFG to do one damn thing about since we've been asking them to fix it for over a year and the canned response was "they appear at all levels" which was utter BS.

The 0 tech RSP fix only effects the top 3 players in uni2 (sometimes some others benefited in insignificant ways from the 0 tech).

really? i'm confused? did you read the WHOLE thread or just selctive parts like others....

so, here lets refresh your inconsistent ability to read:

I forgot to mention, as apparently Matt has forgotten to address, zero techs continue to be available to the top players only. This is now a serious disparity with the rise in defense.

We'll be deploying a fix this afternoon which should eliminate instances of zero tech NPCsappearing except at the lowest level of NPCs.


 AND AFTER THE FIX

Anyway, now that we've gotten rid of that unfair advantage months after I first pointed it out (and was told by Matt I was incorrect about the distribution), let's get some more profit into the NPCs. Please either revert the formula to what it was in this universe or make a new one.

so, now heres the interesting part.

Players that complain, often find themselves loosing out and then complaining about the fixes they asked for.

There are TWO issues here in this thread:

1) defences vs ships.  This has been addressed by bfg.  defences will now ONLY account for a maximum of 40% of the RSP on an NPC.

issues with that (and the complainers)
 a - You don' know whos RSP that that NPC may have spawned off of, so you cannot claim it is unprofitable.
 b - Your obviously assuming incorrectly that every NPC should never have equal to or greater than your RSP, the greater part would never apply to a player ranked #1 on RSP.
 c - Seems some of you just 'LOOK' at the espi report and then feel the need to complain, instead calculate the RSP value of defences and then ships.

2) 0 tech NPCs, and if you can't see that that was addressed as an issue in this thread, best get your reading glasses..

issues with that:
 a - By altering the base on the techs for NPCs now, meaning the lowest value NPCs have the lowest techs vs the highest value having the highest tech, you will see a reduction in profit.

Players complaining previously at how 'hard' it was, will now find it equal or the same......20% less defences with a 20% increase on techs will make no difference to the outcome.  However, now we are finding that npcs which previously gave a bigger profit now have higher level techs.

Sorry, but you can't have your cake and eat it.....and as i stated already, sometimes when you complain to much about things you get kicked hard in the ball bag...........And this is what your doing now.....realising that by complaining you have made things worse for yourselves.
Title: Re: NPCs largely unhittable except for top players' private zero techs
Post by: kru on March 05, 2014, 04:20:02 PM
The 0 tech RSP fix only effects the top 3 players in uni2 (sometimes some others benefited in insignificant ways from the 0 tech).

sigh**

it effects EVERYONE...... techs are or rather now have been completely changed so that techs are more appropiate to the RSP level of the NPC.

{{{{{{might as well talk to a brick wall}}}}}}}}

Even at your level NPCs will now have a wider inclanation to be less than, equal to or even much greater than your own.  Keep an eye on it, you will see what i speak of.

oh and ps......just because one doesn't play a specific universe doesn't mean one doesn't have an understanding.....Afterall, all universes in the underlay are indenticle....

Title: Re: NPCs largely unhittable except for top players' private zero techs
Post by: napl on March 05, 2014, 05:14:05 PM
1) defences vs ships.  This has been addressed by bfg.  defences will now ONLY account for a maximum of 40% of the RSP on an NPC.

Actually, if you were playing uni2 you would know that before this "fix" the defenses were running about 10-20% RSP.  That is the crux of the post.  So by INCREASING the defense RSP to 40%, BFG drastically decreased the profitability.

 a - By altering the base on the techs for NPCs now, meaning the lowest value NPCs have the lowest techs vs the highest value having the highest tech, you will see a reduction in profit.

I haven't noticed any change in the tech levels of the npc in my range, nor has anyone else I talk to, with the exception of the #1 player who now doesn't see 0 techs...I do see what you are getting at though, just haven't noticed it in practice.
Title: Re: NPCs largely unhittable except for top players' private zero techs
Post by: kru on March 05, 2014, 05:30:24 PM

Actually, if you were playing uni2 you would know that before this "fix" the defenses were running about 10-20% RSP.  That is the crux of the post.  So by INCREASING the defense RSP to 40%, BFG drastically decreased the profitability.


ermmmmm, who says BFG have increased it to 40% ? ?  ? ? ? 

BFG have altered the code so that it should not exceede 40%.  In reality you could have NPCs spawn at 0% defences or the max 40%.

And as Matt H has stated:
we've changed this so that ship RSP will now, on average, account for 60% of the RSP available

That means there may be occassions where the defence ratio exceedes that of 40%.

So, ok i understand your frustration in that it appears from your perspective to be worse.  However, on average is the key phrase.....

And again, i will re-iterate my original stance, had certian players from uni2 not been moaning and complaining the change may not have occurred there, but then it could possibly still have changed.

To me, having defences (in your words) spawning at only 10 - 20% of the total RSp seems there was an issue with the code...

Title: Re: NPCs largely unhittable except for top players' private zero techs
Post by: CreoleLakerFan on March 05, 2014, 05:47:57 PM
ermmmmm, who says BFG have increased it to 40% ? ?  ? ? ?

WE are - you know, guys who actually play UNI2, unlike you.  Three of the people who have posted in this thread complaining about the NPCs are in the Top 10 of UNI2.  A fourth used to be a Top 5 player before he traded down, but is still Top 50.  All play UNI2 regularly and have a pretty good idea of what spawns in UNI2 look like, and how they have changed since the fix - since between the four of us we are looking at EVERY NPC spawn that's worth a minimum of 50k Dionysus in debris.

Quote
BFG have altered the code so that it should not exceede 40%.  In reality you could have NPCs spawn at 0% defences or the max 40%.

In reality, there are no NPCs spawning at 0% defenses.  We would would know, because we look at all of them.  Do you?

Quote
And as Matt H has stated:
we've changed this so that ship RSP will now, on average, account for 60% of the RSP available

That means there may be occassions where the defence ratio exceedes that of 40%.

So, ok i understand your frustration in that it appears from your perspective to be worse.  However, on average is the key phrase.....

It is worse across the board.  All of what we are saying is based upon observation and raw data.  This is not an issue of perspective.  This is an issue of fact.  Where are you getting your data?  Your perspective is based upon your opinion, which is based upon nothing, since as far as anyone can tell, you do not even own an UNI2 account.

Quote
And again, i will re-iterate my original stance, had certian players from uni2 not been moaning and complaining the change may not have occurred there, but then it could possibly still have changed.

No one in UNI2 was complaining about spawns - a couple of weeks ago things were great.  The NPC spawn changes were introduced to correct issues in other universes - and apparently they have.  Unfortunately, they have affected UNI2 negatively, and no one from BFG (Matt) seems to be willing to look at the data to validate the complaints.  Instead, it's the canned responses of "the changes are working as intended" without examining the impact it is having on UNI2.
Title: Re: NPCs largely unhittable except for top players' private zero techs
Post by: Matt H on March 05, 2014, 05:52:07 PM
We will not be reverting this change. If you were seeing top end NPCs with 10% to 20% RSP assigned to defenses, then that was entirely too low in the first place and should have been corrected sooner.
Title: Re: NPCs largely unhittable except for top players' private zero techs
Post by: Bah on March 05, 2014, 06:25:01 PM
If you were seeing top end NPCs with 10% to 20% RSP assigned to defenses, then that was entirely too low in the first place and should have been corrected sooner.

Why is that too low? Obviously that's an arbitrary standard and one that results in negative consequences. The current profit margins fail to bring me enjoyment and as such it would be foolish of me to continue.

I hope you reconsider.
Title: Re: NPCs largely unhittable except for top players' private zero techs
Post by: CreoleLakerFan on March 05, 2014, 08:11:41 PM
This all smacks of pointy-haired thinking.  I believe the suits at BFG got together and determined that would like increased revenue from UNI2.  Said suits then directed the development team to lower profit margins on NPC hits with the end goal of extracting more revenue from the userbase in the form of web referrals and raw credit purchases.

This type of thinking marginalizes the paying customer into an asset than can be extorted at will for more revenue.  The problem with this thinking is that the paying customer has the option of taking his business elsewhere.  If you treat your customers as if they have an obligation to subscribe to your service, or no better options, then you will soon find that you have a shortage of customers.
Title: Re: NPCs largely unhittable except for top players' private zero techs
Post by: Matt H on March 05, 2014, 08:16:18 PM
This all smacks of pointy-haired thinking.  I believe the suits at BFG got together and determined that would like increased revenue from UNI2.  Said suits then directed the development team to lower profit margins on NPC hits with the end goal of extracting more revenue from the userbase in the form of web referrals and raw credit purchases.

This type of thinking marginalizes the paying customer into an asset than can be extorted at will for more revenue.  The problem with this thinking is that the paying customer has the option of taking his business elsewhere.  If you treat your customers as if they have an obligation to subscribe to your service, or no better options, then you will soon find that you have a shortage of customers.

This explanation might work if we only changed Uni 2. But we changed every Universe. And based on player feedback about NPCs post update for all Universes, overwhelmingly for the better.

Further, we appreciate when customers opt to purchase credits in our game. But our games are free to play and purchasing credits is optional.
Title: Re: NPCs largely unhittable except for top players' private zero techs
Post by: vanvely on March 05, 2014, 08:36:13 PM
Actually, if you were playing uni2 you would know that before this "fix" the defenses were running about 10-20% RSP.  That is the crux of the post.  So by INCREASING the defense RSP to 40%, BFG drastically decreased the profitability.
lmao, so all this time Uni2 has been enjoying 10-20% defences while the rest of SFC were suffering under 60% defences?

I used to feel sorry for Uni2 thinking that the fix somehow gave them more than 60% defence, instead of reducing it down to 40%. Turns out, you people are complaining because you are no longer getting the special privilege of those 10-20% targets, which were never available to any of the other universes to begin with.
Title: Re: NPCs largely unhittable except for top players' private zero techs
Post by: kru on March 05, 2014, 08:51:25 PM
i would love to see the look on thier faces if they ever probed something like this

Encounter Large Floating Colony  has:
RESOURCES:
* ore: 10,022,323,570,919 
* crystal: 41,522,169,214,756 
* hydrogen: 28,621,635,811,618 
================================
Total plunder: 40,083,064,298,646 (320664515 carm / 1603322572 herc / 8016612860 atlas)
(1944072538086 Dios / 7776290152341 Zags)

URCATH'S SHIPS:
* Artemis Class Fighter: 2,168,154,802,650
* Atlas Class Cargo: 173,122,855,655
* Erebus Class Fighter: 1,782,387,140,640
* Zagreus Class Recycler: 55,618,101,816
* Hercules Class Cargo: 132,957,288,331
* Dionysus Class Recycler: 1,508,688,534
* Curetes Class Cruiser: 26,890,330
* Carmanor Class Cargo: 59,926,715
* Ares Class Bomber: 48,585,400

DEFENSES:
* Missile Battery: 64,221,704,030,831
* Laser Cannon: 4,334,883,377,177
* Pulse Cannon: 64
* Particle Cannon: 106,912,867,969
* Decoy: 1
* Plasma Cannon: 949

TECHS:
* Armor Tech: 20
* Weapons Tech: 20
* Shield Tech: 20
Title: Re: NPCs largely unhittable except for top players' private zero techs
Post by: napl on March 05, 2014, 09:20:47 PM
would look pretty normal to me if I was what, top 5 in the conquest uni?  top 25?  I wouldn't know and I wouldn't speak to it as I don't play that uni...
Title: Re: NPCs largely unhittable except for top players' private zero techs
Post by: vanvely on March 05, 2014, 09:42:31 PM
Here's the Espionage Report for my last hit.

Encounter Large Floating Colony ‎has:

RESOURCES:
* ore: 339,205,053
* crystal: 547,644,406
* hydrogen: 462,869,487

URCATH'S SHIPS:
* Artemis Class Fighter: 183,532
* Atlas Class Cargo: 29,145,050
* Apollo Class Fighter: 78,014
* Zagreus Class Recycler: 2
* Hercules Class Cargo: 4,164,483
* Poseidon Class Cruiser: 6,507,750

DEFENSES:
* Missile Battery: 68,911,315
* Laser Cannon: 12,050,258
* Pulse Cannon: 1,171,095
* Particle Cannon: 1,973,751
* Decoy: 1
* Gauss Cannon: 427,802
* Large Decoy: 1
* Plasma Cannon: 453,607

TECHS:
* Armor Tech: 19
* Shield Tech: 19
* Weapons Tech: 19
And, this is supposed to be an example of a "bad" target? Same goes for all the other examples you posted.

Are you seriously COMPLAINING about these awesome targets? Do you realize what a dream it would be to find these targets in other universes?

Listen to yourself: "In summary, 6.3B Hydrogen losses to generate 50B Ore and 31B Crystal."
Seriously? Losing 6.3B hydro to win back 81B O/C is a reason to complain? You are gaining back OVER 10 times the O/C compared to hydro loss. This is almost unheard of anywhere else.

Nah, I can't feel sorry for you guys.
Title: Re: NPCs largely unhittable except for top players' private zero techs
Post by: CreoleLakerFan on March 05, 2014, 09:48:24 PM
This explanation might work if we only changed Uni 2. But we changed every Universe. And based on player feedback about NPCs post update for all Universes, overwhelmingly for the better.

Further, we appreciate when customers opt to purchase credits in our game. But our games are free to play and purchasing credits is optional.

The point is, it isn't better for UNI2 players.  You (BFG, not "you" personally) have dramatically altered the experience of one segment of your userbase.  When we take issue, you tell us: 

We will not be reverting this change. If you were seeing top end NPCs with 10% to 20% RSP assigned to defenses, then that was entirely too low in the first place and should have been corrected sooner.

In other words:  Deal with it.  We will not revert your experience back to what you have come to expect over the years.  That does not make me feel appreciated as a customer who has supported BFG with my wallet from the moment I discovered this game four-plus years ago.

Thanks.
Title: Re: NPCs largely unhittable except for top players' private zero techs
Post by: CreoleLakerFan on March 05, 2014, 09:54:24 PM
And, this is supposed to be an example of a "bad" target? Same goes for all the other examples you posted.

Are you seriously COMPLAINING about these awesome targets? Do you realize what a dream it would be to find these targets in other universes?

I don't play other universes, so what happens there doesn't concern me.  If this is such a dream, why don't you start from zero in UNI2 so you can enjoy the bountiful targets with the rest of us?  I'm sure if you kept at it for years while all of us in the top 50 stopped playing, eventually you could claim a top spot and reap these rewards.
Title: Re: NPCs largely unhittable except for top players' private zero techs
Post by: vanvely on March 06, 2014, 01:36:06 AM
There's a difference between saying: NPCs are not profitable, vs NPCs are not as profitable as before

You people have been spoiled. The whole basis of your complaint is that you are no longer getting extremely ridiculously awesome NPCs. Well that was your bonus. Consider yourselves lucky.

The 10-20% defences you got previously was unintentional, due to a bug.
When BFG fixed that SFCO bug that made all NPCs into 0 techs, I didn't hear them complaining. No, most people were just thankful that they got to profit from a bug.

The fact is: you've been given a bonus. Most people would look at that bonus and be thankful. You guys are looking at that bonus and asking: Why can't we get MORE of it?
Title: Re: NPCs largely unhittable except for top players' private zero techs
Post by: Pantin on March 06, 2014, 03:38:08 AM
There's a difference between saying: NPCs are not profitable, vs NPCs are not as profitable as before

You people have been spoiled. The whole basis of your complaint is that you are no longer getting extremely ridiculously awesome NPCs. Well that was your bonus. Consider yourselves lucky.

The 10-20% defences you got previously was unintentional, due to a bug.
When BFG fixed that SFCO bug that made all NPCs into 0 techs, I didn't hear them complaining. No, most people were just thankful that they got to profit from a bug.

The fact is: you've been given a bonus. Most people would look at that bonus and be thankful. You guys are looking at that bonus and asking: Why can't we get MORE of it?

+1 to everything in there
Title: Re: NPCs largely unhittable except for top players' private zero techs
Post by: Monkey D. Luffy on March 06, 2014, 06:06:32 AM
The super freebie bonus universe players need to just turn around, and walk away, now that we players from the other universes know the truth. You dopes complained about the profiting by your top players, and BFG made a change that effected all universes because of it - unfortunately for you, the change resulting from your complaining about to much profiting led to your universe's super freebie bonus being turned off...

*cue applause* - "Don't you feel special now"?

You got what you asked for... now enjoy it.

Title: Re: NPCs largely unhittable except for top players' private zero techs
Post by: Defiance on March 06, 2014, 07:33:30 AM
Thats not what happened monkey.  The uni 1 npc rsp fix that was rolled across all universes changedbthe profitability of the npcs. 0 aws npcs fix has had little impact. The fix that was asked for was well received,  the fix forced upon the uni wasnt.  Surely you of all people are not denying players a voice to moan about npcs?
Title: Re: NPCs largely unhittable except for top players' private zero techs
Post by: kru on March 06, 2014, 08:56:49 AM
nobody would ever stop you or try to prevent you or anyone voicing an opinion about something that is broken.

However, whether the fix was wanted or unwanted, the bottom line is for all these years you have had (as described) super freebie NPCs, which have been broken for all those years and have now been fixed to properly spawn.

Trouble is, your not voicing an opinion, your all argumentative.  You cannot say that nobody from UNI2 plays no other universe, nobody from UNI2 hasn't visited the forums since the release of NPCs? ? ? ?

Seems to me as though UNI2 collaborated to keep their mouths shut due to issue of severly HIGH profit NPCs, knowing and realising that their NPCs from UNI2 do not sit in line with other universes.



Bottom line is, UNI2 players are looking for sympathy from anyone who will listen, and you will not find anyone who will listen/  For years you guys had it easy street while other unis faught hard on these forums to prove things were not working as intended.  There has been boycotts all over the place until BFG fixed things, and heres UNI2 complaining that the 'top players' are untouchable......

What any other universe would have given to have had such limited defences
Title: Re: NPCs largely unhittable except for top players' private zero techs
Post by: CAPTAIN SKEENAN on March 06, 2014, 02:21:06 PM
Here's the Espionage Report for my last hit.

Encounter Large Floating Colony ‎has:

RESOURCES:
* ore: 339,205,053
* crystal: 547,644,406
* hydrogen: 462,869,487

URCATH'S SHIPS:
* Artemis Class Fighter: 183,532
* Atlas Class Cargo: 29,145,050
* Apollo Class Fighter: 78,014
* Zagreus Class Recycler: 2
* Hercules Class Cargo: 4,164,483
* Poseidon Class Cruiser: 6,507,750

DEFENSES:
* Missile Battery: 68,911,315
* Laser Cannon: 12,050,258
* Pulse Cannon: 1,171,095
* Particle Cannon: 1,973,751
* Decoy: 1
* Gauss Cannon: 427,802
* Large Decoy: 1
* Plasma Cannon: 453,607

TECHS:
* Armor Tech: 19
* Shield Tech: 19
* Weapons Tech: 19
Actualy I wish this was in uni 2 we'd be cleaning up
Title: Re: NPCs largely unhittable except for top players' private zero techs
Post by: CAPTAIN SKEENAN on March 06, 2014, 02:32:45 PM
I agree I don't see many people from uni2 posting on the forum but I don't know of any collaboration. like the rest of the unis some people get crazy with changes or no changes at all, the only really profitable ones I remember are when they first started, but that didn't last long, then they always seem to go in cycles of profitability some cycles better than others.  the whole start of the thread was only the top two or three guys over the last year or so are the only ones able and except for a few random spawns were getting the most profitable and zero tech npc.
Title: Re: NPCs largely unhittable except for top players' private zero techs
Post by: napl on March 06, 2014, 04:04:33 PM
Exactly what Skeenan said.  We were in a 2+ week cycle of profitable npc, certainly haven't been like that since their introduction here.  You all just assume that to be the case.  To us that's not broken...that was just what we were seeing (typical cycling).  You know, remember the standard refrain from Matt?  "NPC are function as designed". 

Bunch of BFG homers when you feel another uni has an advantage...but you all complain about them when its your issue you want to vent about.
Title: Re: NPCs largely unhittable except for top players' private zero techs
Post by: kru on March 06, 2014, 04:13:52 PM
Exactly what Skeenan said.  We were in a 2+ week cycle of profitable npc, certainly haven't been like that since their introduction here.  You all just assume that to be the case.  To us that's not broken...that was just what we were seeing (typical cycling).  You know, remember the standard refrain from Matt?  "NPC are function as designed". 

Bunch of BFG homers when you feel another uni has an advantage...but you all complain about them when its your issue you want to vent about.

No, most of the ones (including me) that make an open complaint to BFG do so with evidential proof.

Right now, the situation is that you were used to something that was broken in the first place.  However, you don't ask yourself 'well if that was broken and not working as intended, then what else is/was broken and not working as intended?'

Perhaps you didn't see it, or realise it that it was broken until it was fixed.  I mean why would you?  you play with your given right?  However, given the 6 bazillion threads that exist from all universes inciting some sort of issue in regards to NPCs, i myself (in my opinion anyway) find it strange that the only unverse not complaining was UNI2....well, now we know why.

At any point you guys could have stated that in uni2 there is only around the 10 - 20% of RSP associated to defences......that in comparison to the upwards of 60% in almost every other universe.

Title: Re: NPCs largely unhittable except for top players' private zero techs
Post by: napl on March 06, 2014, 04:27:11 PM
so you are saying the NPC didn't cycle in other universes?  Did you all come on here and say, "no worries BFG, we are in a good cycle now"?  Maybe we've been more spoiled than other universes as our bad cycles maybe weren't as bad as other universes.  But again, most of us only play uni2, so we wouldn't know.  Where were you when Morat was providing all the evidence to BFG about the problems with NPC in all universes?  I participated in that thread.  And BFG did nothing to address them with all the evidence that was presented then.  Do you really think we believed that BFG would listen to the year long argument about 0 tech NPC only being available to the top 2-3 players in uni2?  Afterall, that's why kru and monkey are continuing to troll a thread in a uni they don't play.
Title: Re: NPCs largely unhittable except for top players' private zero techs
Post by: kru on March 06, 2014, 04:47:53 PM
so you are saying the NPC didn't cycle in other universes?  Did you all come on here and say, "no worries BFG, we are in a good cycle now"?  Maybe we've been more spoiled than other universes as our bad cycles maybe weren't as bad as other universes.  But again, most of us only play uni2, so we wouldn't know.  Where were you when Morat was providing all the evidence to BFG about the problems with NPC in all universes?  I participated in that thread.  And BFG did nothing to address them with all the evidence that was presented then.  Do you really think we believed that BFG would listen to the year long argument about 0 tech NPC only being available to the top 2-3 players in uni2?  Afterall, that's why kru and monkey are continuing to troll a thread in a uni they don't play.

No, i am not a troll, i am stupid for attempting to explain something so basic to you.  Perhaps if you had your account reset for exploiting a bug you would then understand.

Sure, npcs may cycle from good to bad to modertae to awful, however you stated this:

Actually, if you were playing uni2 you would know that before this "fix" the defenses were running about 10-20% RSP.  That is the crux of the post.  So by INCREASING the defense RSP to 40%, BFG drastically decreased the profitability.

Even prior to any fix, the defences spawning at that percentage was not working as the code should have dictated (thats what your not understanding)

10-20% defences based on the RSP was to low.  I have no idea why you think uni2 was the special universe and that 10-20% was the intended target, when all of the other universe's were displaying upto 7x that amount.

Even Matt stated

We will not be reverting this change. If you were seeing top end NPCs with 10% to 20% RSP assigned to defenses, then that was entirely too low in the first place and should have been corrected sooner.

Title: Re: NPCs largely unhittable except for top players' private zero techs
Post by: CreoleLakerFan on March 06, 2014, 05:31:15 PM
Lowered profits I can deal with.  What I cannot deal with is increased hydrogen costs resulting in overall hydrogen losses.  Consider:

Code: [Select]
Encounter Large Floating Colony [redacted] has:
RESOURCES:
* ore: 668,869,957 
* crystal: 567,612,079 
* hydrogen: 434,594,555 
================================
Total plunder: 835,538,295 (6685 carm / 33422 herc / 167108 atlas)
DSP: 207,646,727.5 (5568468 Dios / 22273871 Zags)

URCATH'S SHIPS:
* Artemis Class Fighter: 1,829,779
* Atlas Class Cargo: 2,342,821
* Apollo Class Fighter: 795,852
* Zagreus Class Recycler: 5,825,616
* Hercules Class Cargo: 125,361
* Dionysus Class Recycler: 80,341
* Poseidon Class Cruiser: 66,763
* Carmanor Class Cargo: 202,818
* Athena Class Battleship: 139,717
* Ares Class Bomber: 46,213
* Hades Class Battleship: 26
* Prometheus Class Destroyer: 2,455,786
* Zeus Class: 810

DEFENSES:
* Missile Battery: 87,929,233
* Laser Cannon: 14,469,138
* Pulse Cannon: 1,598,643
* Particle Cannon: 2,598,235
* Decoy: 1
* Gauss Cannon: 550,933
* Large Decoy: 1
* Plasma Cannon: 577,121

TECHS:
* Armor Tech: 19
* Weapons Tech: 19
* Shield Tech: 19

If I launch my entire fleet at that, this is what I end up with:

Code: [Select]
RSP 10,703,055k 26,545,046k -20,626,463k
If I were convert all of the O/C profit into fuel, I'd end up with 21,977,919, not to mention a trade cost of 10,000 credits.  That results in a net gain of zero fleet additions and 1.3B hydrogen - about 5% of what I need for a full launch.  I'd have to score 20 hits of that nature and spend 200,000 credits in trades to build up enough hydrogen buffer for 1-2 "misses" (UNI2 Top 10 is highly competitive), while my fleet remained static.  I am also paying for the Propulsion Mech and Battle Commander - without them these minuscule "profits" would be eliminated and I would be taking a loss.

Three weeks ago, my fleet could handle 3-4 concurrent hits in the 200-300M DSP range, and I was able to minimize my losses using fodder.  Not so with the current NPCs.  So not only is this not fun, it isn't sustainable.  In a few weeks, I am going to run out of resources to convert to hydrogen, and I am going to run out of credits to use to convert them.  The very simple end result is that if this NPC trend continues, I will no longer be playing this game.

I will now wait for the snappy comebacks from trolls who do not have accounts in UNI2, and Matt.

Title: Re: NPCs largely unhittable except for top players' private zero techs
Post by: kru on March 06, 2014, 06:02:32 PM
1) i never argued that your profit was marginalised, or minimised, or even reduced.

2) you prove my exact point. Had you been operating the correct defensive ratio in the first place, you'd be laughing at the profits.

3) Thanks to moans about 0 tech npcs, AWS will be slightly fluctuated, try reducing that npc by 1 or maybe 2 levels........

4) why you so hating?????? at least you get dsp to add into your profit......those kinds of returns are pretty much standard in unis which offer no dsp on npcs....

That (i am guessing) is an npc that is equal or greater than your rsp????? which again, if you read what i posted in earlier threads will offer some explanation.
If it is showing as green to you, well IDK

i could offer some suggestions:

1 - Increase your hydro store to make conversion more cost effective.
2 - Try slowing your fleet to conserve fuel.
3 - perhaps find another, i am sure one example isn't really a good basis for your thesis

**

i am unsure how your profit is worked out, but if you only make 26 million profit on crystal with plunder and harvest then your doing something wrong..... you would plunder 280+million crystal alone (not to mention the debris field)

debris field is: 171,242,409k   106,838,856k   

so, if you make such a small profit, then as i said, this NPC is seriously red to you
Title: Re: NPCs largely unhittable except for top players' private zero techs
Post by: Bah on March 06, 2014, 06:32:19 PM
Ahh so no change in NPCs. And I see little movement amongst the top player's DSP scores in the last 36 hours.

I knew 4.5 months ago when I started my fifth account in this universe, this would be my last go around. I'll take a break for a week and see if anything changes.
Title: Re: NPCs largely unhittable except for top players' private zero techs
Post by: CreoleLakerFan on March 06, 2014, 08:32:15 PM

i could offer some suggestions:

1 - Increase your hydro store to make conversion more cost effective.

This is a great idea.  My next hydrogen store upgrade requires 268B O/C.  Where do you propose I acquire the resources to upgrade it, given the stingy profits from the modified NPC spawns?

Quote
2 - Try slowing your fleet to conserve fuel.

You apparently missed the statement that the Top 10 for UNI2 is highly competitive.  Were I to reduce my fleet speed to conserve fuel, I would burn hydrogen with NO profit to show for it, because someone else would get there first.

Quote
3 - perhaps find another, i am sure one example isn't really a good basis for your thesis

I chose that one because it's a common example of the spanws we're dealing with in UNI2.

Quote
i am unsure how your profit is worked out, but if you only make 26 million profit on crystal with plunder and harvest then your doing something wrong..... you would plunder 280+million crystal alone (not to mention the debris field)

debris field is: 171,242,409k   106,838,856k   

so, if you make such a small profit, then as i said, this NPC is seriously red to you

Go back and read the post again, the profit line for crystal was 26,545,046k.  That means 26 Billion.
Title: Re: NPCs largely unhittable except for top players' private zero techs
Post by: kru on March 06, 2014, 08:57:17 PM
This is a great idea.  My next hydrogen store upgrade requires 268B O/C.  Where do you propose I acquire the resources to upgrade it, given the stingy profits from the modified NPC spawns?

ermmmm, save for it like everyone else has to seriously, you want that on a plate as well?

 

You apparently missed the statement that the Top 10 for UNI2 is highly competitive.  Were I to reduce my fleet speed to conserve fuel, I would burn hydrogen with NO profit to show for it, because someone else would get there first.

then stop moaning....you want to go 100% speed, then expect to pay for it

I chose that one because it's a common example of the spanws we're dealing with in UNI2.

sure, show us some 'common' examples of equal or lesser RSP valued npcs instead of greater ones

Go back and read the post again, the profit line for crystal was 26,545,046k.  That means 26 Billion.

yep, like i said, that is obviously a  RED rsp value npc to you.....if your loosing 160 BILLION ore and roughly 70 BILLION cyrtsal, then it is beyond your means (at this time)

Sure, i make a few mistakes on the initial math, but the logic is sound.  Your still execting to go around smacking higher value npcs like they were before bfg fixed the defence ratio, and cereatnly before Bah complained about 0 techs.

Things have changed (as pointed out in one of the post, it has drastically changed things) and therefore so do the players.

You can't just expect to continue onwards now as you were 48 hours ago......take a few hours to best ascertain which are the best ones for you to strike out at
Title: Re: NPCs largely unhittable except for top players' private zero techs
Post by: napl on March 06, 2014, 09:05:19 PM
Here's 44 pages of reading pleasure for you kru.  From December 2012, before you started playing again I take it (so I'm sure its completely irrelevant).  That's where the complaints of the 0-tech npc started...

http://forum.playstarfleet.com/index.php?topic=18651.0

oh wait...I see you have posted in that thread...so you already know the player base has been complaining about 0 tech npc for only the highest ranking players for over a year.
Title: Re: NPCs largely unhittable except for top players' private zero techs
Post by: CreoleLakerFan on March 06, 2014, 09:20:47 PM
Sure, i make a few mistakes on the initial math, but the logic is sound.  Your still execting to go around smacking higher value npcs like they were before bfg fixed the defence ratio, and cereatnly before Bah complained about 0 techs.

Things have changed (as pointed out in one of the post, it has drastically changed things) and therefore so do the players.

You can't just expect to continue onwards now as you were 48 hours ago......take a few hours to best ascertain which are the best ones for you to strike out at

Nothing about your logic is sound because you do not play in UNI2, so you have no idea what you are talking about.

Title: Re: NPCs largely unhittable except for top players' private zero techs
Post by: Matt H on March 06, 2014, 09:25:24 PM
I'm locking this thread because it's devolved into "You don't play in my thread, so you're ignorant" arguments.

The simple fact is, we've fixed 0 tech NPCs and we won't be reducing the amount of defenses on NPCs. If you were seeing lower amount previously, that was in error and we should have fixed it much sooner.