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Messages - Swanvesta

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Extreme Universe 2 / Re: Sad day to be KBF
« on: July 24, 2015, 09:12:22 PM »
Bullshit. You had barely any facts at all not true, I continually gave evidence to support my claims, and then argued your petty childish ignorant attempts to undermine hundreds of years worth of research,

and YOU were the one who started misquoting. Like Einstein EVER believed in a god the way the term is commonly used, or the way we were discussing it.again lies from you, you tried to claim the quote I gave originally was from an atheist that was using metaphors, I proved that wrong by giving the original quote, and then giving you an entire history of Einsteins religious beliefs, but again this (the red part) is you distorting what happened, using deliberate misinterpretation of events to try and further your cause, which really is ridiculous since the damn stuff is a few pages backwards, hardly worth the effort to prove wrong, you've also generalised, lied and changed the meaning of a well known quote

Absolutely ridiculous. This is why fame sucks: Idiots make claims about your beliefs that aren't remotely true long after you're dead and you can't call them out on it. Einstein was very vocal on his beliefs, I never once said he believed in god, I did however infer he believed in a higher power, which he himself recognised as not only possible but probable (quoted fact), it is you, who tried to misquote Einstein into being an atheist, which he himself repeatedly stated he was not.

Read the links. And stop making shit up while you're at it. ;) The only person making shit up, is you.. i've categorically used your words or my words to formulate responses, then i've given evidence to support those responses, to which you've lied, trolled, misquoted, brought out of context information, and continued with what is apparently a fools errand of being right even when wrong.. give up, you arent winning, you're just looking a fool.

Projection. *YAWN* See, no substance, no evidence, no argument just a fools repetitive jargon, that i wonder if he even knows the real meaning of, did someone teach you that word a short while ago? is it new and need to be used often? poor kiddy

Extreme Universe 2 / Re: Sad day to be KBF
« on: July 24, 2015, 08:52:58 PM »
When you stopped attempting to make arguments and switched gears to trolling, you lost. No more effort on my part is required. Projection!!!!!!!!!! I was using fact, well established long written undeniable FACT, you needed to put a spin, misquote, outright lie, then switched to trolling.. i saw it early on, you fall into a pattern of, saying things like "no, you are wrong" "projection" etc without any basis

Then we'll be here a looooong time. Because I'm as much a better troll than you as I am smarter than you. That's quite a bit. HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA and then you woke up, tell me again how Scientific Theory is a process in the natural world, or how Theory is fact and cannot and will never be disproved, please :D

Pot meet kettle. You're the one still posting, without substance, without argument, without so much as a whiff of common sense, you're the only person that could be seen as having some need to "win" without actually obtaining it in any force of argument.

Extreme Universe 2 / Re: Sad day to be KBF
« on: July 24, 2015, 08:39:36 PM »
yep and there we have it.. with no debating skills, you've devolved into nothing more than repetitive b.s. of the highest degree..

We can do this all night fella, i wanted a good debate, but you're incapable of having one of those and now i see that this has become a contest of who will post last trolling spam.. I'll carry on til you're blue in the face..

you see that type of crap as a win.. and i wouldnt want that.

Extreme Universe 2 / Re: Sad day to be KBF
« on: July 24, 2015, 08:30:26 PM »
No, you haven't. still disagreeing without substance

Still projecting. still using the same crap you do to everyone that's better than you

So you enjoy the discussion when you are talking with other ignorant people, but when someone with brains shows up you have a bad time. Got ya. still using that same tiresome ego of yours to cover the truth

Keep projecting. Or get off your ass and learn something. I think you're in denial, i just schooled you, and you're too thick to understand it

Extreme Universe 2 / Re: Sad day to be KBF
« on: July 24, 2015, 08:21:10 PM »
You've been owned kid. Deal with it.

No, I've just been enlightened, for a short while, I gave you some credit, where it's obviously apparent no credit is due.. Your points aren't sharp, your insults inoffensive.. You took a really good subject to talk about and showed the world, you cannot hold your own.

I've had this same discussion many times in the past, I quite frankly love it, but with you on the other side of the table, we didn't get past the opening remarks before the "debate" became nothing more than having to constantly argue point after point with absolutely no ground given to fact or reason..

It was a waste of time.. maybe i'm the bigger fool for entertaining it, as long as i did.. but, i know how to rectify those kinds of mistake.. you unfortunately will stay a fool an awful long time with your attitude towards learning.

Extreme Universe 2 / Re: Sad day to be KBF
« on: July 24, 2015, 08:12:33 PM »
yeah, you just hit my bullshit threshold.. you failed the intellectual challenge, so now you come with the same crap you do everyone else...

you cant even hold an argument, you cant process information, you cant stay on point.. is there anything you can do besides make yourself look a fool?

Extreme Universe 2 / Re: Sad day to be KBF
« on: July 24, 2015, 07:47:52 PM »
"The word god is for me nothing more than the expression and product of human weaknesses, the Bible a collection of honourable, but still primitive legends which are nevertheless pretty childish. No interpretation no matter how subtle can (for me) change this."

-Albert Einstein, admitting he's an atheist. Pro tip: atheism and agnosticism describe different things. Agnosticism speaks about knowledge, atheism about belief. You can be an agnostic atheist (most are, as I pointed out a few posts ago), or a gnostic atheist (the atheist you foolishly thought described all atheists). Lern2english.

OMG - so you again pick out the tiny reference, which by the way is misquoted and out of context, that somehow seems like it justifies your trolling, even though you have to add your own intrepretation to his words..real deal.. no need for me to change or misinterpret anything

 "I have repeatedly said that in my opinion the idea of a personal god is a childlike one. You may call me an agnostic, but I do not share the crusading spirit of the professional atheist whose fervor is mostly due to a painful act of liberation from the fetters of religious indoctrination received in youth. I prefer an attitude of humility corresponding to the weakness of our intellectual understanding of nature and of our own being."

"In view of such harmony in the cosmos which I, with my limited human mind, am able to recognize, there are yet people who say there is no God. But what really makes me angry is that they quote me for the support of such views."

Extreme Universe 2 / Re: Sad day to be KBF
« on: July 24, 2015, 07:36:41 PM »
You've come with absolutely no fact at all and trolled.. the only person here using projection is you.. It's also quite funny, that is your argument to anyone with anything negative to say about you..

But, once again you show absolutely no understanding for the nuances of the Scientific method, then rather learning something, you've grabbed at one word in the entire document, to try and win a small victory.

Every Scientific theory is a hypothesis, however, every Scientific hypothesis is not a theory.

This is clearly and unmistakably marked as an obsolete theory, widely used and successful even though it was eventually replaced, there of course was a hypothesis to begin the process. But, that is not what they meant by your little copy paste "victory".

You use generalisations without basis, assumptions without the education, Unlike you, I do read fully the documents I'm using as evidence, that's why I can constantly, ridicule your position.

You think Scientific theories are fact!!!! LOL they are not. they are a hypothesis, collected evidence, and conclusions, which then undergo peer review and are constantly challenged/modified and/or made obsolete when something closer to truth becomes available. I could make a theory about you and put it on the web for review, that doesnt mean its true or factual.

The thing you tried to say Theories were, is Scientific LAW, those are observed processes in the natural world, they are tested repeatedly and will always show true under the same conditions, often resulting in mathematical equations.

Now seriously, do yourself a favour.. check the mirror because you're making yourself look like a fool, maybe you don't care, but I've better things to do with my time then try to teach a guy that doesn't want to or cannot learn.

as for the whole "projection" crap, there is proof on this damn forum of your inability to stop, even to the point of making up lies, and when those lies are shown, you say "i was just trolling" like that means something to anyone.. we all know you're a fool.. try doing something else for a change.

Eradeon Extreme Universe / Re: Hard lesson learn.
« on: July 24, 2015, 03:24:27 PM »
Glad to see this, do it regularly, otherwise he'll just rebuild quicker than anyone else.

was hard work staying ahead of him, but then I'm an insomniac, I've a lot of time to play :D

Extreme Universe 2 / Re: Sad day to be KBF
« on: July 24, 2015, 02:06:12 PM »
And just to show some of your fabricated shit, I went and did some research and found the truth, you know that ol' chestnut science at work again..

And that scientist was an atheist, who used the term god as a metaphor so everyone could easily understand his awe. I use the term too on occasion, that doesn't make me a believer. It's part of English. It's literally impossible to grow up without hearing or using it in a English speaking area.

“The more I study science, the more I believe in God.”

–Albert Einstein (at best, Einstein was agnostic (which is neither belief nor disbelieve in God, but he repeatedly and undeniably denied being atheist, going as far as to mock them on many occasions)

Here's some more, extremely well known scientists, with IQ's you could only dream about, that also believe in a higher power.

“The question of whether there exists a Creator and Ruler of the Universe has been answered in the affirmative by some of the highest intellects that have ever existed.”

–Charles Darwin

“This sense of wonder leads most scientists to a Superior Being – der Alte, the Old One, as Einstein affectionately called the Deity – a Superior Intelligence, the Lord of all Creation and Natural Law.”

—Abdus Salam

“A scientific discovery is also a religious discovery. There is no conflict between science and religion. Our knowledge of God is made larger with every discovery we make about the world.”

–Joseph H. Taylor, Jr

“It may seem bizarre, but in my opinion science offers a surer path to God than religion.”

–Paul Davies

“I believe that the more thoroughly science is studied, the further does it take us from anything comparable to atheism.”

“If you study science deep enough and long enough, it will force you to believe in God.”

—Lord William Kelvin

This one is just for you...

“The fanatical atheists are like slaves who are still feeling the weight of their chains which they have thrown off after hard struggle. They are creatures who – in their grudge against traditional religion as the ‘opium of the masses’ – cannot hear the music of the spheres.”

—Albert Einstein

Extreme Universe 2 / Re: Sad day to be KBF
« on: July 24, 2015, 10:48:51 AM »
^ One giant load of horseshit. You know shit about how science works, shit about it in general, shit about religion, and shit about atheism. Here's some reading for you.

FYI, your own link agrees with me that caloric theory wasn't a theory. Rofl. Not that wikipedia is a great source to mention, but whatever.

That's where you're wrong.. but i know you well enough to know, even when wrong you'll never back down.. you'll even go to the lengths of making shit up, just to seem like you're right.. no-where on that page does it say "caloric theory" wasnt actually a theory.. In fact it does say how it was used tested and seen in literature for centuries.

and then, like a parting jab because you know there was an awful lot of truth to what i said on those pages, and your words just wasnt enough to fool yourself, you mock the source (while using it yourself)

OK wiki, isnt the absolute in research material.. but much like the rest of science, its under constant review.. if you write crap up there and someone spots it.. they can write about it.. and no-one loves disproving crap better than scientists.. which is why it's usually good information there.

The thing I like most about this, is the guy who doesn't think science works well, actually knows more about science, than the guy claiming to. You mistakenly thought of Scientific theory as Scientific Law..

Extreme Universe 2 / Re: Sad day to be KBF
« on: July 24, 2015, 12:43:30 AM »
ah man.. I'm not going to even bother with you, I've had enough for today.. you really need to check your facts.. I did.. what you just prattled off was no more than trolling for your egos sake.. very little insight or real content.

and dude.. picking at one word.. as in my use of the word life, instead of "natural world"  to somehow make your incorrect assertions of "process" plausible, is how grace and brianC manage to own you regularly.

here's some light reading for you...

I love the way you nonchalantly, say scientific theories have never been disproved, then given evidence against that, turn your back on science, and go with belief..pseudo-science my ass.. Newtons theory held for 100 years.. your statements dont hold for 5 minutes.. says alot ..

Extreme Universe 2 / Re: Sad day to be KBF
« on: July 23, 2015, 11:25:07 PM »
See the bold, and improve your reading comprehension.

did you really just do that.. you emboldened the piece that you had to skip over the point to get to :D

Then you haven't listened to many atheists, because I've only very rarely heard atheists claim they believe there is no god. Such people do exist, but they are a very small minority in the overall atheist population.

You can't say that anymore, because I'm an atheist, and I lack belief in any god. If evidence for a god is ever presented to me, I'll reevaluate my position. But so far that hasn't happened.

There is evidence of a higher power of sorts, we can get to that shortly if you wish, however I think religion is man-made, the same as science, it's man's perception of the physical world

And belief in science is perfectly valid. It also has nothing to do with the question of a god. A whole lot of theists believe in science, and a bunch of atheists don't. The Flat Earth Society is made up of atheists, for example. And the Catholic church has embraced science. Religion and science can coexist. Only fools think otherwise.

I think you either missed my point, or went off on your own here. It's well known that some of the most venerated scientists were indeed believers in religion. I cant remember who or the exact quote, but a well known physicist said something like "The more we find in science, the closer I feel to God"

Depends how you do it. If you're methodical and never try the same password twice then it's a victory for science. If you just randomly type shit then it's dumb luck.

All very scientific of you. Until...

That's not science. Science can't, and doesn't try, to deal with complete unknowns. The closest thing you can point to is the dark matter/dark energy issue. But they aren't complete unknowns. There are mathematical flaws in our understanding of gravity and universal expansion. Dark matter/dark energy are hypothetical solutions to these flaws that scientists are searching for. We'll eventually find them, or we'll find out that something else can account for the flaws. Because of the scientific method.

But, that was my point perhaps poorly made. Here are things, which we've conceptualised but our scientific method: prediction, cannot give us accurate information.. It will always be the case, imo, that rather than being ahead of the curve, we'll always be chasing the ideas til they smack us in the face, and we say "oh that's how that works"

If you want an answer for meaning or gods or magic or ghosts, science can't and won't help you. Not until something testable presents itself. But that isn't a flaw in science, it's a strength. It's why it always works. You'll have to try something else for that stuff, and you'll have to take it on faith. Science doesn't deal with faith, it deals with testable, repeatable, material, provable phenomena.

Bullshit. The entire foundation of christianity is the books used to compile the bible, and they make extremely specific claims on what is and isn't moral. The same is true for every religion I'm familiar with. It's possible there are some religions that don't set morality in stone, but all of them combined don't even equate to 1% of the religious population.

As far as I'm concerned, the bible, Christianity and every other religion on Earth are man-made, religions themselves would be nothing without belief and followers.. you see where i was going with that?

No. Our society of 200 years ago was built on religion. Our society today is built on science. WWI contained the first major steps towards a shift to science. WWII turned steps into leaps. And since WWII, science has taken over.

You said our entire civilisation was built on..  but looking at the raw numbers, only the last, shall we be kind and say 2% of our civilisation was science built. I agree, we're now pushed forward by science, religion still plays a part for billions of people though.

No scientific theory has EVER been proved wrong. EVER. Science has never been proved wrong. You need to learn what science is, because right now you're incredibly ignorant.

You should look up "caloric heat" or "caloric theory" just off the top of my head :P

Theory is a scientific statement that has been tested and retested ad absurdum until it can be said with near absolute certainty that something is true. Evolution is a theory. Gravity is a theory. A theory is a process. Not a definition. Light was never a theory, because light isn't a process.

I know the difference, sometimes I'm sloppy with my wording.. but theory, even in science does not mean fact. Even if the theory can be used in practical applications, it doesn't mean we've got it right, it just means we've tapped into something through blind luck.

But, I'm not sure you do know the difference, Scientific theory is not a process, but an explanation into some aspect of life substantiated via the scientific method.

Light is electromagnetic radiation. That we've not yet defined it to our satisfaction has absolutely no impact on the usefulness of science. If not for science, we wouldn't know as much about it as we do. And we'd never be able to define it.

It was just an example, but actually there has been Theories of light, including one from Newton himself :P

The moon landing. Quantum computers. Genetics. Satelites. Space probes. Nuclear technology. I could go on for years. None of these would be possible without science.

OK I can dig these examples, somewhat better than, the car i drive and computer i use etc

Extreme Universe 2 / Re: Sad day to be KBF
« on: July 23, 2015, 10:32:13 PM »
quoted for truth?

Extreme Universe 2 / Re: Sad day to be KBF
« on: July 23, 2015, 10:18:43 PM »
When determining risk you do not just look at the immediate risk based on the current circs, your have to look at history....History shows that between (and doing this research was very hard) 1970 - 1982 Russia set its nuclear arsenal to launch conditions more than 25 times.....compared to America's 6 (7 if you count the system crit failure)

All the pro Russians in this thread have all failed and averted to the fact that ONLY Putin has made statement and claim to the use of nuclear weapons......well, no shit sherlock.....that speaks volumes initself

So, we're suppose to forget about the only power to have actually dropped nukes during hostilities and is busily conquering the world and building military bases, and concentrate our fear on the guys, whom, conceivably tested their systems 25 times and threatened once, even after so much provocation?

I'm English, my parents and grand parents are English (I can trace the lineage back to the late middle ages), many of my family have fought for this country. This does not prove my point, but logic, fact and reasonable deductions do.

I'm just not brainwashed into thinking the military way.. You're so quick to label Putin indoctrinated, but can't see, whatever service you was part of, did the same damn thing to you. But that's a cop out, you do have a choice to think about it, rather than grasping for whatever slim pieces of distorted information you can find to support your belief, but you don't.. and that my friend, is the true meaning of indoctrination, you were fed a line, and you swallowed it without even checking to see if there was a hook. and here you are, years later like the little pet robot you are, spouting the crap they wanted you to follow unquestioning.

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