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Author Topic: Has there been a change to the NPCs that we weren't told about?...  (Read 13714 times)

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Offline iam 1

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Re: Has there been a change to the NPCs that we weren't told about?...
« Reply #195 on: November 10, 2013, 03:45:36 PM »
You have a great point Skeenan and the past 3-4 days are a great example. My fleets have set idle more than in the air.  Even when I find a target to hit the defenses make it close to zero profit. I find myself stealing targets from the lower ranked players just to fuel losses. Shameful.  Once again the "Cycle" raises it's ugly head.  Something really needs to be addressed here.

Offline GraemeCracker

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Re: Has there been a change to the NPCs that we weren't told about?...
« Reply #196 on: November 10, 2013, 05:58:49 PM »
"that when I reach the point of having to spend hundreds of Septillions of resources just to gain 1 single level of a mine, that won't pay out a return of investment for the next 22,000 years... I would have to lose my mind and go mental, to think that it's a good investment of my resources. - That's just my personal opinion, mind you."

And exactly what level will take hundreds of septillions of res anyway? Furthermore, if ANY of you were doing ANY math at all, you'd know that ships have ROI too. Inevitably, spending a billion resources on mines has a better roi than on ships. If you have to wait 22k years to see a return, you're still better off going that route than waiting 22m years.

Storage has 0 roi. It saves you real money, but it doesn't ever produce anything. And there's a maximum useful benefit to it. We'll all be dead before a level 80 storage would be useful in any uni save perhaps Conquest. Therefore there is a lot of room to work with, and mines are a practical and effective use for that space.

There are various ROI's in play in this game.  There are the simple direct calculations, like building a mine, where the return (in res) can be compared to the cost (in res) and a time window for ROI can easily be calculated.  If the game was nothing but who has the most res, then this would be the only factor.  Attacks are similar.  The amount of res spent in hydro and replacing losses vs the res plundered and harvested.  However attacks yield DSP too, which figures into your rank, and being efficient at increasing rank is what the game is about.  Other investments, like foundries lead to more efficient rank increases, because you need to convert res to RSP in order to climb the ranks (or at a bare minimum replace RSP lost).

The other ROI is the actual dollars (credits) spent.  Here is where storage come into play.  Storage does increase you RSP, and any RSP spent increases your rank, but it also increases you merchant efficiency.  No one would deny that if you had an unlimited amount of money to spend on credits, you could buy your way to the lop of the leader board.  Since no one has an unlimited budget, credit efficiency comes into play, not just in your own personal finances, but in having an effect in your rank too.

Offline CAPTAIN SKEENAN

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Re: Has there been a change to the NPCs that we weren't told about?...
« Reply #197 on: November 10, 2013, 10:07:49 PM »
You have a great point Skeenan and the past 3-4 days are a great example. My fleets have set idle more than in the air.  Even when I find a target to hit the defenses make it close to zero profit. I find myself stealing targets from the lower ranked players just to fuel losses. Shameful.  Once again the "Cycle" raises it's ugly head.  Something really needs to be addressed here.
Yes npc are rough for most two big fleets get great profits and 99 percent of the zero techs while we struggle to find anything profitable

Offline The Algebraist

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Re: Has there been a change to the NPCs that we weren't told about?...
« Reply #198 on: November 12, 2013, 03:22:07 AM »
Dead right Iam 1. I'm sat right behind you in Uni2 and would have enjoyed chasing you ...... but no worthwhile targets. :)

Offline bob the tattler

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Re: Has there been a change to the NPCs that we weren't told about?...
« Reply #199 on: November 12, 2013, 06:18:14 PM »
I might also ask if there has been a change to the timing of NPC's. For the last two days big NPC's have been evaporating minutes before my hits land. They were not there before I tucked the fleet away about 8-10 hours previously, so its not like they have been baking there for a whole day or so. I have currently wasted well over a billion in hydro on this and if it continues, it becomes a very easy decision on what to do when my current stock of credits runs out.

No bang bang, no pay pay.

Offline Pantin

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Re: Has there been a change to the NPCs that we weren't told about?...
« Reply #200 on: November 12, 2013, 06:43:33 PM »
No one would deny that if you had an unlimited amount of money to spend on credits, you could buy your way to the lop of the leader board. 

WGW  ;D

Vastet

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Re: Has there been a change to the NPCs that we weren't told about?...
« Reply #201 on: November 13, 2013, 01:43:03 AM »
Since noone is capable of understanding my argument and responding logically and rationally, I'm no longer wasting my time trying to educate them. Keep throwing straw men and quoting out of context all you like. I'm not going to read it anymore. Anyone capable can see I'm right with what I've posted already, so there's really no point in continuing to defend the obvious.

Offline Dr NoLove

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Re: Has there been a change to the NPCs that we weren't told about?...
« Reply #202 on: November 16, 2013, 10:57:11 AM »
Since noone is capable of understanding my argument and responding logically and rationally, I'm no longer wasting my time trying to educate them. Keep throwing straw men and quoting out of context all you like. I'm not going to read it anymore. Anyone capable can see I'm right with what I've posted already, so there's really no point in continuing to defend the obvious.
LOL what a jackass. Let me count the reasons why you have no credibility. If you would like to make one point that I haven't specifically countered, I'd love to hear it.
« Last Edit: November 16, 2013, 11:03:52 AM by Dr NoLove »

Offline Stem1986

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Re: Has there been a change to the NPCs that we weren't told about?...
« Reply #203 on: January 01, 2014, 08:50:21 PM »
Is it me or do the NPC now have double or triple amount of defense they had previously. I could hit an NPC with 10 million DSP with 1 million proms but now with the same amount of proms I can only hit NPC worth about 3 million DSP.

Offline Monkey D. Luffy

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Re: Has there been a change to the NPCs that we weren't told about?...
« Reply #204 on: January 01, 2014, 09:16:17 PM »
You are correct... however, as far as BFG is concerned, everything id fine... the only thing that they have to say about that, is this:

We have not made any changes to the NPCs.
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Offline Zarchne

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Re: Has there been a change to the NPCs that we weren't told about?...
« Reply #205 on: January 01, 2014, 10:05:29 PM »
this:

Quote from: Matt H on August 14, 2013, 03:42:23 AM

They haven't said that since the launch of Hired Guns, though.  Not since, even about a week before that, they removed newbie protection on Conquest territories and I believe nerfed the Wormhole fleets (I could be wrong about that; I lost remaining interest when they removed the newbie protection on territories).

Incidentally, Hired Guns has NPCs with (what seem to me to be) fairly normal ships and defenses and AWS, except that in the actual battles, it's clear that the AWS isn't being applied to the defender's units.  That is, all NPCs are effectively 0 tech when attacked.

Offline Monkey D. Luffy

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Re: Has there been a change to the NPCs that we weren't told about?...
« Reply #206 on: January 01, 2014, 10:20:58 PM »
They haven't said that since the launch of Hired Guns, though.  Not since, even about a week before that, they removed newbie protection on Conquest territories and I believe nerfed the Wormhole fleets (I could be wrong about that; I lost remaining interest when they removed the newbie protection on territories).

Incidentally, Hired Guns has NPCs with (what seem to me to be) fairly normal ships and defenses and AWS, except that in the actual battles, it's clear that the AWS isn't being applied to the defender's units.  That is, all NPCs are effectively 0 tech when attacked.

That doesn't explain the abnormalities to the NPCs in X2... for which they haven't announced having made any changes to.
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Offline Zarchne

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Re: Has there been a change to the NPCs that we weren't told about?...
« Reply #207 on: January 01, 2014, 10:34:59 PM »
That doesn't explain the abnormalities to the NPCs in X2... for which they haven't announced having made any changes to.

Well, it depends.  What I said (and you've also noticed, I believe) was that they no longer are saying that they haven't made changes.  I have no reason to doubt that for the months that Matt H said that no changes were being made to the NPCs, despite periodic complaints, that the NPCs were in fact on an autopilot, apparently one that amplified randomness in player RSP levels.

In any case, not announcing actual changes is completely normal for BFG.  Having changes in one universe inadvertently (so they claim) affect another universe also happens from time time, with the explanation that much of the code base is shared.

There is another possibility, to which Hired Guns directly relates.

Offline Monkey D. Luffy

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Re: Has there been a change to the NPCs that we weren't told about?...
« Reply #208 on: January 01, 2014, 11:12:55 PM »
Okay... alright then,... how about this... I'll just be my usual direct self...

Matt,... have there been any recent changes to the NPCs (particularly in X2) that we haven't been told about?...

(who knows how that'll go... anyway, lets see what kind of answer I get?)
« Last Edit: January 01, 2014, 11:15:12 PM by Monkey D. Luffy »
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Offline Rogan

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Re: Has there been a change to the NPCs that we weren't told about?...
« Reply #209 on: January 02, 2014, 06:08:00 PM »
I would ask what the formula is for calculating NPC's to be displayed. what is used to calculate the stats. BUT I know BFG would never release proprietary formula's for anything which may give an advantage to any player in a conversation.

I think BFG's whole premise formula is subject to GIGO and the data they are using to make the formula work is subject to question.

For instance all players are included in the formula regardless of playing mode. Are the NPC's included as well? might as well be... could achieve the same affect as bigger NPC's jack the formula.

One of the major issues I've heard about is the ratio of RSP/Ships/Defenses, just set minimals and maximums and race to plunder the NPC's --- no ingame formula calculating what or how big something is... based off some random collection of player/NPC data ... Does the formula include roving Heph's?

Just saying ...
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