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June 27, 2019, 06:24:13 AM

Author Topic: Remove the Oracle  (Read 2317 times)

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Offline jackeast

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Re: Remove the Oracle
« Reply #30 on: February 27, 2010, 11:20:30 PM »
I dont mind the oracle... however I have a suggestion.  Modify what the ORACLE can see.  make it tied to Espionage levels and then create an algorithm that makes it harder to see fleets as they get smaller.  A fleet of 1000 combat ships may be seen 99% accurately, while a fleet of 100 ships may be randomly seen only 10% of the time.  If a fleet survives being seen once it is safe until it reaches a planet or moon, then it has to survive being seen again next time it moves.  In this version perhaps the recall can be seen.  Just a possible suggestion.  It sort of levels the playing field for the little guys and focuses the effort on the big guys.  I mean that is what the ORACLE is really for right?  It is designed for higher ranking players to be able to orchestrate massive battles and start shaking up the top standings.

This will also start to break up the massive fleets so that lower ranking players can start to have an effect on higher ranked players.  The only way to do that now is to coordinate among many alliance members, which more "recreational" players have a hard time doing.  If the ORACLE starts restricting fleet sizes among the larger players to about 200 ships, then the mid-size and even smaller players can start to have an impact in the game, making them more active.  It may also lure some out of "D" mode.
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Offline Kronos

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Re: Remove the Oracle
« Reply #31 on: February 28, 2010, 01:01:18 AM »
+1
sounds great to me, add a rationale to the device does help, but more importantly bringing in mid ranked players, making them feel useful cant be a bad thing, can it?
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Offline Nyder

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Re: Remove the Oracle
« Reply #32 on: February 28, 2010, 05:56:49 AM »
The oracle is just too unbalancing. I cannot always be at my keyboard within 10 seconds of the fleet's return. Diplomacy is not an option as it slows production down too much for me and I cannot use my fleets. Diplomacy is a good tool, but not as a permanent status. What then becomes the point of this game?
The range of the oracle needs to be severely reduced (maybe like one system per level to a maximum of 5). The cost of the scan could be made higher. Even still, it favours the higher ranked players and will remove the enjoyment form the lower ranked (less than 100) players.
I have left the extreme version because of the intensity of the game - I could not be at the keyboard to the extent required of that game. It stops being fun. If the regular game becomes too unbalanced, I am prepared to pack up my marbles and go home. There has been some discussion and concerns within our alliance about this as well.
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Offline Bleys

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Re: Remove the Oracle
« Reply #33 on: February 28, 2010, 07:24:53 AM »
Quote from: "Nyder"
The oracle is just too unbalancing.

I will try to address your points one at a time.

I cannot always be at my keyboard within 10 seconds of the fleet's return.

You dont have to be. A simple check anytime within the flights last hour should be sufficient (half hour for Extreme). Its likely if your fleet is spotted, the planet will be scanned for defenses as well. Unless they are in your system, they have to launch. Heck, you may even be able to muster up a Ninja if the attacker isnt careful, if you spot the attack or the threat of one in time.

Diplomacy is not an option as it slows production down too much for me and I cannot use my fleets. Diplomacy is a good tool, but not as a permanent status. What then becomes the point of this game?

So you do not wish to use the safest tool available because its too limiting. Good. So learn to avoid the Oracle. There are lots of posts on all the boards about how. The wiki has info about how. And the safest non-Dip mode way is getting a moon yourself to fleetsave from. They are expensive too, but its the best method there is, so how can it not be worth it? Then, you will have Oracles too, and since they guarantee success (sarcasm), you will go straight to the top!


The range of the oracle needs to be severely reduced (maybe like one system per level to a maximum of 5). The cost of the scan could be made higher. Even still, it favours the higher ranked players and will remove the enjoyment form the lower ranked (less than 100) players.

You do understand that recalled deploys are a massive waste to an attacker, right? Do you think it will be so common to see attacks once an Oracle user wastes a ton of hydro for nothing? Again, you seem to think you will see an attack every day or something. You wont. No one will. The few times it MIGHT happen, be alert enough to recall and it just might discourage that guy from trying again. Yes, there will be some who will try multiple times. Those guys dont last long, they get ninjaed. Predictability works both ways.
 

I have left the extreme version because of the intensity of the game - I could not be at the keyboard to the extent required of that game. It stops being fun. If the regular game becomes too unbalanced, I am prepared to pack up my marbles and go home. There has been some discussion and concerns within our alliance about this as well.

Why not see how it actually goes instead of projecting the worst-case-scenario and reacting on those projections? Hundreds of thousands of players across the entire world play this game just fine. SFC is hardly the only clone of O-Game you know. Why is it they seem to manage to play, yet you cant adjust? I understand that Extreme isnt for everyone. Heck, SFC itself isnt for everyone. Maybe its just not right for you. But I see a LOT of intelligence in the majority of the "whiner", and I am pretty sure the majority of you will be jsut fine. How about you actually see how it goes?

Seriously people, try to understand. After years of testing by millions of players, the Oracle concept has been proven to NOT be as unbalancing as any of you imagine. You are seeing it for the first time and knee-jerking. Fine. But lets see what happens eh? A few Ninjas, a bunch of wasted hydro on fruitless attacks, and you will see that its no game-breaking thing, this Oracle. Personally, I think Jump Gates are WAY more powerful. I can scan from multiple moons, find the juiciest targets, jump and hit em. Every gate I make doubles my effective hunting radius. Oracles are bush-league compared to that.
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Offline darkset

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Re: Remove the Oracle
« Reply #34 on: February 28, 2010, 11:34:16 AM »
i have been playing for 3 months now im ranked 51 and i have wanted the oracle since day one and i would quit if they took it out and one who thinks it unbalanced needs to reread all the points that have been made by many players there is no way that everyone will be hit with it so suck it up
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Offline Lord Popo

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Re: Remove the Oracle
« Reply #35 on: March 01, 2010, 06:28:03 PM »
I have posted a great compromise in the Oracle disscussion.

It is as thus:
The Oracle should be a systems wide scan that gives general details. It lists the details in a report in a style much like this.
-Planet X has fleets a,b,c,d,e travelling at %speed with ~ore/crystal/hydro
-Planet Y has fleets a,b,c,d,e travelling at %speed with ~ore/crystal/hydro
etc.

This doesn't fully hide fleetsaves, but it also doesn't take them away. It balances the Oracle's power and still lets it be a great advantage. It also opens up the door to mid-flight battles and with advance com networks tech it also opens the door to mid-flight route changes. Two new changes that would really make this game interesting.
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Offline davide

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Re: Remove the Oracle
« Reply #36 on: March 03, 2010, 01:00:13 AM »
Quote from: "darkset"
i have been playing for 3 months now im ranked 51 and i have wanted the oracle since day one and i would quit if they took it out and one who thinks it unbalanced needs to reread all the points that have been made by many players there is no way that everyone will be hit with it so suck it up

I have ready what everyone has posted, on both sides, and I keep coming to the conclusion that it's unbalanced. So you just saying it's not isn't very convincing.

The basic idea behind the oracle is cool, but this particular implementation is flawed. There have been numerous proposals for relatively minor other changes that would bring it back into balance. Maybe you should read some of those and explain why they would be such a problem.

All we keep hearing out of the other side is "it's balanced", "you don't know what you are doing" and "is so powerful we are racing to build them and will quick if they change".... That doesn't make a convincing argument.

Many people have laid out why they think it's unbalanced, but no-one has laid out why the proposed sets of fixes would be so horrible, the answer is "not needed it's not unbalanced".

So, why would the following each of the following mods be so bad:
1) allow speed to be changed on returning ships
2) prevent oracle from scanning harvest missions
3) Add a tech that alters the accuracy of the time estimate that oracle returns
4) create a blocking device to jam the oracle, in the same spirit that ABMs block IPBMs
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Offline A. Hachie

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Re: Remove the Oracle
« Reply #37 on: March 03, 2010, 01:35:05 AM »
SFC you ARE NOT O-Game, stop trying to be please.  If i wanted these BS features, i would play there.
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Offline Cannon balls

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Re: Remove the Oracle
« Reply #38 on: March 03, 2010, 01:38:31 AM »
one simple fix and would more represent real life battle. The ability to change the speed of your ships mid flight. Slow them down/speed them up. Making harvests invisible to an oracle defeats the purpose of the oracle completely.
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Offline davide

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Re: Remove the Oracle
« Reply #39 on: March 03, 2010, 02:40:13 AM »
Quote from: "Cannon balls"
one simple fix and would more represent real life battle. The ability to change the speed of your ships mid flight. Slow them down/speed them up. Making harvests invisible to an oracle defeats the purpose of the oracle completely.

I don't really care which of the fixes they put in place (well, I have my favorite, but I don't care a lot which one they put in place)

I just want them to put SOMETHING in place to balance it out and not make it such an unbalanced let the top end players kill anyone with no defense that it is now.
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Offline evb

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Re: Remove the Oracle
« Reply #40 on: March 03, 2010, 03:53:41 AM »
Offer in flight [Speed] adjust and fleet [Divert] options.
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Offline Victor Doom

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Re: Remove the Oracle
« Reply #41 on: March 03, 2010, 05:41:03 AM »
:twisted: I LIKE the Fleet Diversion and/or Speed up/Slow Down Option... That would give the captian of the fleet the ability to throw off ANY oracle type ambush...
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Offline LauriKotaja

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Re: Remove the Oracle
« Reply #42 on: March 03, 2010, 09:24:04 AM »
with moon and an oracle you are able to see all but stealth yourself.

Have planets? You are now pray for moon dudes to divide as they see fit.
Have a moon? See all, and be safe.

Like having a moon makes you a funing GOD in the game.

This is bullshit.

Suggesting to have harvest missions to remain hidden - in this way the imbalance would only be overwhealming instead of impossible.
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Offline Bleys

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Re: Remove the Oracle
« Reply #43 on: March 03, 2010, 03:32:43 PM »
Sigh, its endless. Clueless people projecting the end of the world.
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Brute Force, if its not working, you\'re just not using enough.

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Offline angelskyss

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Re: Remove the Oracle
« Reply #44 on: March 03, 2010, 04:35:25 PM »
codename_B.............that picture  :lol:  :lol:  is that you? ha ha .. :P  :P  :P  :P .......hope u dont mind a little teasing...... :P  ;)

I just would like to see some fix minor of a defense against oracle for those of us who can not be at keyboard all the time constantly due to very very very long work hours....really like the game and dont want be limited....maybe some sort of very high espion level that semi blocks the oracles ability to see some of it like harvests...but make these blockers high level so you would  have to work hard to get to where it slightly limits some of what it sees..after all i worked hard at beginning to get those espion levels. I hate to see all that work on high espio levels be less useful now.....maybe the oracle could be limited in what it sees for those players under 25 k so folks could get a chance to grow get a moon and be able to fight with the big guys....not a complete not see just a slight limit on it for lower players so they could harvest or something but all fleet movement but harvest were seen if u lower level... like a oracle newbie protect..once they grow beyond that would have to deal with oracle fully.  and i know moons protect but at lower levels its hard to waste fleets to get them.....and I ask that you please dont yell at me if u dont agree with my suggestions..... i like the general idea of the oracle. just want it to be a little feasable for those who work...ok waiting for someone to yell at me over my ideas.....
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