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Author Topic: Player admits to having cheated, is cheating again.  (Read 4733 times)

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Offline Big S

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Re: Player admits to having cheated, is cheating again.
« Reply #60 on: January 13, 2011, 01:53:16 AM »
Quote from: "Swanvesta"
in all fairness i thought our conversation regarding the actual topic had ended.. you agreed there was a miscommunication , i agreed i was wrong about packet sniffing, which were the 2 main points of interest?

after that the rest was just heated debate on the rights and wrong of what each other had said during that ..

would you like to continue with it..?

i think we left off at anything else is speculation... i am right though, IF all that is being done regarding multi-accounts is that the ip's are being cross referenced, then the ways i hypothesized would indeed cause the system to fail.

with the volume of tickets i ASSUME support receives of this nature it would take a long time to sift through and check them all.

since u are trying to derail the last pieces of the conversation, maybe we should start right here

In your experience how would you detect or stop multi-accounting via methods such as i described? i did a little research earlier and their are scripts which can be added to the websites code which enables the author instant knowledge apparently that there is a proxy in use.

however this doesnt stop something like what i described using msn...
I honestly don't know how many "he is cheating" tickets they get each day. I don't know how much spare time Jason ever has when investigating. Logic would suggest that if they are getting a lot of reports about the same "player(s)" they would take a little more time on that case.

That said, as before, I have agreed with you that a person could, with enough ingenuity and knowledge and resources, work in such a way that it would be virtually impossible to determine.

Now if BFG wanted to crack down on the use of proxies, they could do something like the following. Have the IP of the host be reported in the web page to the user browser. It could even be a hidden field. Then have the browser supply that piece of info along with the real IP when they submit a HTTP request. This would provide almost proof positive evidence, since the two IPs would not match if a proxy was being used. And off the top of my head, supposing the user disabled JS or was able to hijack the script from the server to defeat this detection, I suppose you could probably use a hash or something that would notify the server that the script was tampered with, and therefore be able to auto-suspend the account. That would be the direction I would take. I'm not deeply familiar with all the possibilities within JS, so maybe that's not even possible. But I have to believe they can do better than they currently do about detecting certain types of cheating. Hell, I provided an idea a while back about how to break those annoying "warning-SMS" scripts. If they are keying on certain div tags in the page, all they have to do is when they take the site down for maintenance, change the div tags in the code and in the CSS file. This sounds non-trivial, but it really doesn't have to be, since I'm very sure they would be using templates for their page skeletons which are dynamically populated with content.


Crap. I accidently edited instead of adding a new post. I meant to create an addendum to this post, so hopefully this restores the original post out of my browser cache. The additional info as follows:
I did a quick look at this. Apparently javascript has no direct way of learning the host browser's IP. But Java does, and it can be called within Javascript. If BFG really wanted to crack down, they could enforce Java being enabled and just say that they are doing this to protect the integrity of the game, therefore if you have some hang up about not enabling Java, then don't play the game.

Ugh. Another edit. I just realized this would be completely unworkable. Anyone behind a NAT router/firewall would be reported as different from the host browser IP. Need to go back to the drawing board on that.
« Last Edit: January 13, 2011, 02:11:16 AM by Big S »
Quote from: \"Evan Woodard\"
I\'m pretty sure that\'s just D-baggery.

Offline Big S

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Re: Player admits to having cheated, is cheating again.
« Reply #61 on: January 13, 2011, 01:56:45 AM »
Quote from: "Swanvesta"
erm.. there is one thing abbreviating words, entirely another changing the meaning to them
We will have to agree to disagree. Honestly who is reading this anymore? You know I'm never going to admit I'm wrong to use American English, because I know I'm not wrong to use American English. And I can't tell if your point is a front or if you honestely believe what you say. Either way, we can continue wasting each other's time trying to say this is different or that doesn't apply...or just stop. I think this is a fairly gracious way of me suggesting we should just stop.
« Last Edit: January 01, 1970, 12:00:00 AM by Guest »
Quote from: \"Evan Woodard\"
I\'m pretty sure that\'s just D-baggery.

Offline Swanvesta

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Re: Player admits to having cheated, is cheating again.
« Reply #62 on: January 13, 2011, 02:08:01 AM »
i agree, was actually quite fun crossing swords with you .. we may not agree ever on the points, but at least we can say we expressed ourselves properly, even if there was a bit of needless banter on both sides ..

just for the record, i dont mind netspeak or whatever its called "abbreviation" but if we are getting technical yes i do prefer the Queen English to be used, and i can follow it correctly..It's a language to be proud of, something we've fought over, something forced, something borrowed, something refined and something so sophisticated when used correctly it can make u feel every word. Im proud to be English, and of the heritage behind that. And even our Royal family is part German, so it didnt come as any shock to hear our language has Germanic roots. But it has evolved a long way from there, and still holds a few words from the old English from before those times.

I am not making you wrong for using US English, however, to me, those meanings will forever be wrong :)


with that said,

this is the script i found earlier

http://www.phpbuddy.com/article.php?id=22

in all fairness my capacity to understand the script is limited, but it seems like it might fail under the same circumstances u have just details
« Last Edit: January 01, 1970, 12:00:00 AM by Guest »
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Offline Big S

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Re: Player admits to having cheated, is cheating again.
« Reply #63 on: January 13, 2011, 02:54:44 AM »
It looks like these are unreliable headers. It depends on the proxy server following "rules" :-).

I've done enough PHP development that I was immediately suspicious seeing as that script looked to be using common HTTP headers, and I know from experience that I could set up a PHP server that took these environment variables and populate them with whatever values you want and then pass the GET/POST along to another server. In essence a homemade proxy that will put any values in the headers you want.

A little searching confirmed my suspicion that there are proxies that deliberately "lie" to the web server in order to completely hide the host behind the proxy.
http://www.freeproxy.ru/en/free_proxy/f ... nymity.htm

A script like that would probably thwart a lot of malicious users, but not all. At least not those who are a little more selective on which proxies they use.
« Last Edit: January 01, 1970, 12:00:00 AM by Guest »
Quote from: \"Evan Woodard\"
I\'m pretty sure that\'s just D-baggery.

Offline Scott Ellison

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Re: Player admits to having cheated, is cheating again.
« Reply #64 on: April 08, 2011, 10:15:42 PM »
Does it seem ridiculously unfair to anyone else that people who get caught pushing with a small moonshot get the same 3 day suspension as people who do planned long term multi accounting or massive pushing like Boris and Village Idiot?

I'm not saying that some cheating shouldn't be punished but not all cheating is equal so why is the punishment?
« Last Edit: January 01, 1970, 12:00:00 AM by Guest »

Offline The Grinch

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Re: Player admits to having cheated, is cheating again.
« Reply #65 on: April 08, 2011, 11:36:57 PM »
This thread is intense LOL... Swanny... come back!
« Last Edit: January 01, 1970, 12:00:00 AM by Guest »

The Soloist

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Re: Player admits to having cheated, is cheating again.
« Reply #66 on: June 30, 2011, 02:18:22 AM »
Shit, most of these accounts were mine, maybe we should talk about it instead of Phil.
« Last Edit: January 01, 1970, 12:00:00 AM by Guest »

Offline Gershwyn

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Re: Player admits to having cheated, is cheating again.
« Reply #67 on: June 30, 2011, 07:07:52 AM »
Quote from: "Sid82"
Quote from: "the enforcer"
yes so it is ok that he is cheating by playing multipule accounts as starters for others?

fyi i am coming to destroy you. you won't be able to do shit, better go start lvl your own account in x2.
Personally, I hate cheaters. That being said, I always love it when someone tells me they are coming to destroy me and I won't be able to do anything. It reminds me of good ole airhead jones back when my old alliance was at war with unimat0. He was always launching multiple attacks on me after I moved a planet up to help another member of the alliance out. I would let him know that I was on and was going to move everything out of the way(was before my actual fleet got there) and he would reply that it didn't matter because he was keeping me from building up. I would wait for his attack to get close, and then take about 4 minutes to FRS and avoid his attack, then when my ships back, go on about building things. I guess the point here is, don't be an idiot, if the person is good at FRS there really isn't much you can do about it except hope they make a mistake.

Umm... Well yes for the most part, or, you can get a line up of people just firing away at them all day for a while. That got me before I quit and returned.


Re: this thread

I do disagree with things here and there but I'm generally quite content with BFG's work. I mean, sure there are a LOT of things that could be done to make it better but the simple question is: you're all still here, right?

As for cheating, while flattery, I for one am rather pi**ed off if someone cheats to get ahead in a game regardless of circumstance. If you're cheating, you're cutting corners that those of us who do work want to shoot you for. Example: DON'T do it.

Lastly to clear it up: Delta's supposed IP message of suspension was about PUSHING if you read it. NOT IP addresses. If it were based off of IP then my brother and I wouldn't have been able to play for a while.
« Last Edit: January 01, 1970, 12:00:00 AM by Guest »
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The Soloist

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Re: Player admits to having cheated, is cheating again.
« Reply #68 on: June 30, 2011, 07:17:26 AM »
Quote from: "Gershwyn"
Quote from: "Sid82"
Quote from: "the enforcer"
yes so it is ok that he is cheating by playing multipule accounts as starters for others?

fyi i am coming to destroy you. you won't be able to do shit, better go start lvl your own account in x2.
Personally, I hate cheaters. That being said, I always love it when someone tells me they are coming to destroy me and I won't be able to do anything. It reminds me of good ole airhead jones back when my old alliance was at war with unimat0. He was always launching multiple attacks on me after I moved a planet up to help another member of the alliance out. I would let him know that I was on and was going to move everything out of the way(was before my actual fleet got there) and he would reply that it didn't matter because he was keeping me from building up. I would wait for his attack to get close, and then take about 4 minutes to FRS and avoid his attack, then when my ships back, go on about building things. I guess the point here is, don't be an idiot, if the person is good at FRS there really isn't much you can do about it except hope they make a mistake.

Umm... Well yes for the most part, or, you can get a line up of people just firing away at them all day for a while. That got me before I quit and returned.


Re: this thread

I do disagree with things here and there but I'm generally quite content with BFG's work. I mean, sure there are a LOT of things that could be done to make it better but the simple question is: you're all still here, right?

As for cheating, while flattery, I for one am rather pi**ed off if someone cheats to get ahead in a game regardless of circumstance. If you're cheating, you're cutting corners that those of us who do work want to shoot you for. Example: DON'T do it.

Lastly to clear it up: Delta's supposed IP message of suspension was about PUSHING if you read it. NOT IP addresses. If it were based off of IP then my brother and I wouldn't have been able to play for a while.

Just to clarify, in case you were wondering, I (the player that was at one time Dr. Delta) am not multi accounting at the moment.  I have no intentions of it, but as that little queer pop star says, Never Say Never.
« Last Edit: January 01, 1970, 12:00:00 AM by Guest »

Offline Gershwyn

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Re: Player admits to having cheated, is cheating again.
« Reply #69 on: June 30, 2011, 07:34:15 PM »
I'm pretty sure it's Never Shout Never, haha. And now that I'm awake and not posting running off of no sleep, cheating sucks. Sure, you're fine, you're not multiaccounting right now and that's great! But I still dislike cheaters/cheating as I was never able to explain to my teacher that his standards were too high and that I had the only failing grade because I was the only one not cheating.

But really, this isn't school, isn't life, it's a game. You do what you want/need to do and that's just that. This entire thread was rather pointless aside from pointing something out. Whether you can or can't cheat, there will always be cheaters. Someone wil find a loophole. Sure, there's also occasional justification, but it's still cheating. We can get mad, but what exactly are we going to do about it?

(hooray for contradicting myself)
« Last Edit: January 01, 1970, 12:00:00 AM by Guest »
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Offline Sid82

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Re: Player admits to having cheated, is cheating again.
« Reply #70 on: June 30, 2011, 07:38:29 PM »
Just curious, this thread is months old....why is it being brought up again?
« Last Edit: January 01, 1970, 12:00:00 AM by Guest »
Quote from: \"LHDR\"
Quote from: \"Sid82\"
-1 don\'t need a reason other than this is a stupid idea
Quote from: \"LHDR\"
"Great spirits have always encountered opposition from mediocre minds."~Albert Einstein
doesn\'t work when idea IS stupid
viewtopic.php?f=7&t=8493

Offline Gershwyn

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Re: Player admits to having cheated, is cheating again.
« Reply #71 on: June 30, 2011, 07:55:49 PM »
Lol because I, and probably many others, didn't see the timestamp on the first post.
« Last Edit: January 01, 1970, 12:00:00 AM by Guest »
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