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February 24, 2020, 10:58:46 AM

Author Topic: Monitor class ships  (Read 1350 times)

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Offline Perseus

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Re: Monitor class ships
« Reply #15 on: April 23, 2010, 03:19:32 AM »
That's a bad strategy. That guy lost over 2.2 million OC in Arties doing that, and the fleet that he hit was very Poseidon weak. Also, if the enemy also has a good amount of Artemis you'll be screwed over.
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Offline Major Edwin

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Re: Monitor class ships
« Reply #16 on: April 23, 2010, 03:56:24 AM »
Right, sending a fleet of pure artemis is a bad strategy that can be countered with poseidons or large numbers. the point that I was trying to make was that each ship has a balance of strengths and weaknesses.

I didn't notice that he lost that much OC. I just saw the percent loss and assumed that it wasn't much. Thanks for pointing that out.
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Offline Bravicus

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Re: Monitor class ships
« Reply #17 on: April 23, 2010, 06:09:01 AM »
SO basically this ship would be like an orbital defense station, mobile (and therefore fleetsavable) but slow (and therefore worthless to attack actives with).  That is the basic premise right?

The problem is ground defenses have a 70% chance to be rebuilt and therefore are much more cost effective as you can blow up the same defenses multiple times and not have to pay to rebuild them.  Also ground defenses do not generate debris (oh how I hate them for that) and therefore do not provide incentive to destroy them (outside of "hey look at this turtle I crushed" chest thumping) this ship would generate debris so instead of scaring off attackers it invites them.

Furemer, I get that part of what you try to do on the forums is suggest some new ideas (which is great this game is quite nearly an oooooogame clone) but for the ideas to be viable they have to either add a new and balanced element to the game or make things simpler and more manageable.  Truly this does not do either an equal amount of res invested into d will produce better defensive results and it doesn't add anything to attacking.  Also it doesn't streamline things.
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Offline Bravicus

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Re: Monitor class ships
« Reply #18 on: April 23, 2010, 06:16:33 AM »
Actually I am seeing an application for this ship, if it had rapid fire on defenses (something similar to ares) it could be a very effective way of cracking those large inactive turtles.  Of course that might render the ares obsolete in many cases.
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Offline Perseus

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Re: Monitor class ships
« Reply #19 on: April 23, 2010, 01:26:59 PM »
Quote from: "Bravicus"
Actually I am seeing an application for this ship, if it had rapid fire on defenses (something similar to ares) it could be a very effective way of cracking those large inactive turtles.  Of course that might render the ares obsolete in many cases.

It wouldn't render the Ares obsolete, it would BE the Ares. This ship basically already exists, but the Ares has higher weapons/shields/hull.
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Offline furemer

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Re: Monitor class ships
« Reply #20 on: May 06, 2010, 02:47:40 AM »
the concept of a monitor is similair to that of the ares yes,  but the areas is for the most part strictly a planetary assualt craft

a monitor would in most games also be able to assist in that role but likely not be as proficient as the ship designed specifically for that role...

Ok fist is this just a game of numbers?  Or is this suppossed to be a game simulating real in a theritical sense space plaentary assualts and fleet actions?  

In a strict game sense.  A monitor type ship would provide another option of play.  A ship that surrenders speed and potential range, i.e. requiring a fuel ship for mulit galaxy travels.  For extra defense and weapons.  
Turtles don't need ships besides flreighters?  Yet how many times have I read players compalin cuase turtles won't make ships, and that should somehow be forced to?  Why? Especially when all the ships presented are specifically for fleeter/raiders.  
Many turtles might like to have a selection of such ships of various sizes recieved at differenet stages of tech just like the raider ships.  Many turtles and some balance players might be inclined to build some as escorts for their fleets of frieghters.  Why do I need escorts that can travel how much faster than my freighters?   If this IS a war game you are going to try to say no one would be smart enough to use escorts?  
Used a as "mobile defense" monitors allow a player to go into a unprotected zone and mount a presentable defense.  Such as dropping a new colony in.  The monitors do NOT replace ground defenses the are used to enhance and support those defenses.  

Further there are people that play, and more than a few that have left that dislike the entire concept of FS or nothin.  OK SO ITS SUPPOSSED TO BE A WAR GAME.  Well not all of us agree with the concept of leaving our planets open to be plundered.  That means building multiple layers of defenses.  Stationary and mobile.  Sure wee would still fleet save protect resources.   But there are those of us that find the whole concept of running away distasteful.  


Whats the point of having a space fleet if you are just going to run away and let your planet die.  If this was a realistic game and not one that was just about gaining points for status if you were to leave your planets like that you would die fast.  




Does the concept potnetially change the balance of the game? YES
It might actaully make it a true war game.  

You want to play a game about gaining status? Go play the fasion game , models something or the other.
Feature requests are where we express what we would like to see, not just what fits the current model.  I want I die hard, empire building, fleet smashing, blood drawn battle game.
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Offline Major Edwin

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Re: Monitor class ships
« Reply #21 on: May 06, 2010, 03:54:01 AM »
Ive been looking through other posts and I can't seem to find this: why would turtles build this as opposed to fleetsaving?
« Last Edit: January 01, 1970, 12:00:00 AM by Guest »
I envision a world without war and without hate.

And I can see us attacking that world because they wouldn\'t expect it. - Jack Handy

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Offline Perseus

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Re: Monitor class ships
« Reply #22 on: May 06, 2010, 04:19:00 AM »
Quote from: "furemer"
the concept of a monitor is similair to that of the ares yes,  but the areas is for the most part strictly a planetary assualt craft

a monitor would in most games also be able to assist in that role but likely not be as proficient as the ship designed specifically for that role...

Ok fist is this just a game of numbers? Yes Or is this suppossed to be a game simulating real in a theritical sense space plaentary assualts and fleet actions?  

In a strict game sense.  A monitor type ship would provide another option of play.  A ship that surrenders speed and potential range, i.e. requiring a fuel ship for mulit galaxy travels.  For extra defense and weapons.  
Turtles don't need ships besides flreighters?  Yet how many times have I read players compalin cuase turtles won't make ships, and that should somehow be forced to?  Why? Especially when all the ships presented are specifically for fleeter/raiders.  
Many turtles might like to have a selection of such ships of various sizes recieved at differenet stages of tech just like the raider ships.  Many turtles and some balance players might be inclined to build some as escorts for their fleets of frieghters.  Why do I need escorts that can travel how much faster than my freighters? I don't know, since your fleets can't be attacked in transit...  If this IS a war game you are going to try to say no one would be smart enough to use escorts?  
Used a as "mobile defense" monitors allow a player to go into a unprotected zone and mount a presentable defense.  Such as dropping a new colony in.  The monitors do NOT replace ground defenses the are used to enhance and support those defenses. Defenses that give DSP's and don't respawn, fleeters would love that.  

Further there are people that play, and more than a few that have left that dislike the entire concept of FS or nothin.  OK SO ITS SUPPOSSED TO BE A WAR GAME.  Well not all of us agree with the concept of leaving our planets open to be plundered.  That means building multiple layers of defenses.  Stationary and mobile.  Sure wee would still fleet save protect resources.   But there are those of us that find the whole concept of running away distasteful.  Then you'll lose your fleet, whether you "agree" with having to fleetsave or not.

Whats the point of having a space fleet if you are just going to run away and let your planet die.  If this was a realistic game and not one that was just about gaining points for status if you were to leave your planets like that you would die fast. Unfortunatly, it isn't realistic, and the whole purpose of it IS to gain points.  




Does the concept potnetially change the balance of the game? YES
It might actaully make it a true war game.  

You want to play a game about gaining status? Go play the fasion game , models something or the other.
Feature requests are where we express what we would like to see, not just what fits the current model.  I want I die hard, empire building, fleet smashing, blood drawn battle game.

My comments are in red, and I still don't really get what you're trying to accomplish with this ship.
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Offline Rob

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Re: Monitor class ships
« Reply #23 on: May 06, 2010, 12:50:59 PM »
This is *not* a defensive game. The game mechanics are specifically set up to ensure that large portions of the game are weighted toward attackers. (And no, I don't consider fleet-saving to be "defending". It's running away. Or dodging, if the term "running away" bruises your ego.) Without significant changes to the underlying game mechanics, actually defending anything is completely pointless. Therefore, any ship designed to be specifically a defensive ship is also...pointless.
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Offline poeticmotion

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Re: Monitor class ships
« Reply #24 on: May 06, 2010, 12:55:45 PM »
I love this concept.

Why? Because people that are dumb enough to build these to defend their worlds will be great. Instead of having to blow up defenses, I can blow up these, and get debris and killpoints out of it.

From a guy who loves blowing stuff up, +1000. Even though I'll never build one, they sound fun to shoot down.
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